3 BIGGEST MYTHS to The Law of Attraction: Manifest Your Reality

Lewis Howes
Welcome to this special masterclass. We've brought some of the top experts in the world to help you unlock the power of your life through this specific theme today. It's going to be powerful. So let's go ahead and dive in.

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Rick Rubin
The thing is, if you're in grief and despair. It's very slow. Right. And that is. That's a protective mechanism for all of us.

Because I had one time in my life where I hit depression and because I was extremely worried about my daughter, and I just. There was just, like, this black cloud, and I thought. I have completely thought myself to hear. I could see all of the scary thoughts that I believed, and I am here now. Here is where I am.

And I knew I was here because. To experience it so I could help people out of depression. And so. So no one else created you to get there. Oh, I did it.

Lewis Howes
You created yourself? Oh, yeah. I tried everything that I knew, which was to be grateful and to think positive thoughts. So I tried thinking positive thoughts. I could feel how weak they were.

What do you mean by that? Like, they didn't have a lot of. Power behind them, so they were like, I'm gonna. I'm happy, but I'm not really happy. Not feeling it, because the depression was, you know, it was strong.

Rick Rubin
And so what I did was I decided to not resist the depression, but to love it. Tell me more. And it melted away. What does that look like? If someone's going through three to six months?

I had to imagine this. I had to create, like, a picture of this, but I kind of. Like, I could feel the sensation of it, because depression is just a sensation. All of our feelings are just sensations, and they're not actually us, they're just a sensation. But I could.

I would get that sensation, and I would feel that sensation of depression. And then I just imagined putting my arms around it and pulling it into me. And that was hard to do, not. Pushing it away or resisting it, because. That'S what we do, you see, we push away bad feelings because we don't want to feel the pain.

Right. We numb them. We try to escape from them. Exactly. We do everything.

But I did the opposite, because I knew what you resist persists, right? Yes. And so I just imagined putting my arms around. The moment that I did it, it just evaporated, that whole feeling of depression. And then a couple of hours later, it started to come back.

Not nearly that same level. Did it again in three days. Was totally gone. How long had you been experiencing the depression for? Was this weeks?

Lewis Howes
Was this months? It was like a couple of weeks. Couple of weeks? Mm hmm. And if you would have resisted it or numbed it or tried to escape it.

Rick Rubin
Yeah, I'd still be there. Really? Yeah. So what I'm hearing you say is that you embracing the sadness, the pain, the grief, the loss, whatever it might be, but embracing it and creating a relationship with it, as opposed to pushing it away, allowed it to flow through you and leave you. Yeah.

It can't stay because nothing negative can remain in the face of love. Wow. Love is the light. And everything negative you could say, is darkness is one way to look at it. And so if there's love, the darkness just disappears.

And that's why it just evaporated was the most incredible feeling. And I knew, I'm experiencing this so I can share it with people. How does someone, I mean, the secret, 34 million plus copies. You know, tens of millions of people have watched the movie. All the other books and programs and products that you have, have been, you know, sold by millions of people have been bought these things.

Lewis Howes
How does someone believe they are worthy of great things? The way you have been able to do great things in your life and impact the world in such a magnitude that you have done. How can someone know and trust that something is destined for them? Maybe it's not at this level, but something as great as destined for them. How do they know that?

And did you know this your entire life leading up to this, that something like this was supposed to happen? No, I didn't. Really? No. But the moment I discovered it, I knew it.

Rick Rubin
I absolutely knew it. I knew this is why I was here. I knew it with every fiber of my being. Yeah. So.

But prior to that, I didn't. I was really ambitious. Okay, you were driven. You had a business, you were driven. But when I say ambitious, I was only wanting to perfect, be great myself.

I wasn't in competition with anybody. I wasn't trying to be better than that person or I just wanted to be the best that I could be. And so I didn't. But after I discovered the secret and my whole life turned completely around, 360 I look back on my life and I saw that every single thing in my life was leading to this. Really?

Yes. Because just even things like I worked in the newsroom for, in a radio station. And, um. And so when the secret went crazy, like crazy, and I just had every news media outlet in the world, in every country, coming at us, and I did very little. And because I knew that what happens, what can happen, is that the media will build you up to tear you down.

Lewis Howes
Wow. And I knew that because I had worked in news and I'd worked in media, and so I had seen it. Is that why you did very. You did Oprah and that was really. I did Oprah and I did Oprah, because I knew Oprah lived this.

Rick Rubin
And you see, I didn't want to go onto anything where I didn't want to have arguments with people because I'm not trying to convince you to do anything. I discovered something and I wanted to share it. And if you find that it's incredible for your life, then I'm so happy. If you don't want to hear about it, that's fine, too. So I didn't want to get into situations with people where they're like, oh, this is, you know, as if the mind can do this.

This is all there is, is mind. You know, they don't even realize, like, it'll be hundreds of years before, before it is realized what the substance of the universe really, really is. But right now, we can use this knowledge to completely create the life we deserve to have. And what you were talking about, about being this great greatness, I think some of us were born to do something like this. But then there are others.

And I think about this with my mother. Right. My mother stopped working when she was like, 19 years old and she had five children. But my mother achieved greatness because she was an incredible mother and she was an incredible wife. And so her level was different.

And I think, you know, what you did or what I did, not everybody is prepared to take the risks. You took risks? Yes. You can't do it without the risks. Yeah, I took huge risks by, I put everything on the line.

I would have been on the streets. You know, I, like, mortgaged, overdraft. I did everything possible to get the secret out to the world, and I didn't care, honestly, what happened to me after it. I just wanted to get it to the world, and that was it. And so you have to have, there's something within you that really pushes you.

But then there are people that they might love what they do, you know, and they don't want to be running a company. They don't want the stress of that. They love their family. They want to spend as much time with their family as possible. They just really love to have a better house or, you know, and I think, and I think, honestly, if you can live your life and you can bring joy to other people just by your presence.

Just by your presence, if you can do that, oh, my God, you've lived the greatest life possible. You really have. Because every single person, their true nature is joy and their true nature is love. And that's why you feel so good when you enjoy, right? Right.

Lewis Howes
Yeah. And that's why we feel so good. When we're loving and being, loving is smiling to that person like you did, you know, I'm opening the doors and I'm in a smile. Yes, absolutely. Yeah.

I mean, you talk about kindness, this is the next thing. On top of here, you just said, kindness. We're in sync right here. Kindness changes everything. Want to see your life change for the better today?

Then be the kindest you've ever been to every person you encounter. When you do that, it's hard to have a bad day. Oh, you can't. It's not possible. That's why.

Rick Rubin
Just do that. You know, like, I'm like, just do that one thing and you don't take my word for it. Try it for yourself and just see for yourself what happens. Yeah, I remember this person contacted us and really early on, and he said he decided that he was just going to be happy. I think it was a hairdresser.

And he said, I'm just going, I'm making a decision that I am going to be happy and I'm going to see what happens. And it was incredible what happened in his life. Got his own hairdressing salon and all of. Just because he made a decision to be happy. What, what's on the happiness frequency?

Everything that you want to make you happy. Absolutely. You know, so I'm curious about after the secret came out and every news outlet in the world wanted to hear more about what you were creating. You do Oprah, which that, you know, blows up everywhere. You're time 100 most influential person in the world.

Lewis Howes
You're selling tens of millions of copies within the first few years. This message was everywhere. You could not go into a store without seeing this book. No, true. How did you navigate the success and not let that weight or pressure break you?

Because some people want the impact, the success, but then they're not ready for it. How did you prepare yourself? And was that a conscious decision? Not to do a lot of interviews after that, to not be picked at or try to be pulled down in. Certain ways, that was a conscious decision.

Rick Rubin
It was.

Lewis Howes
But, like, did you feel ready for the success? Did you feel prepared or did you feel like this is a little overwhelming? I never felt it was me. What do you mean? I just.

Rick Rubin
It was the message that was the star. Interesting. And I never felt that it was me. Like, even writing the secret book, I absolutely knew that. And making the documentary, like, it was a miracle what happened.

Making that documentary the way everything that we ever needed just landed right at our feet. It was so spectacular. It was the most incredible thing I've ever seen. And I just knew the universe, you know, just putting that in that most affectionate way, I knew the universe was with us, and so. And writing the book, it was the same thing.

Like, I felt such a rush in writing that book. I couldn't write it fast enough. All the things that I'd learned and practiced and I wanted to share with people, but, you know, I had, like, I got a burst blood vessel in one of my eyes. I had. My feet got all cracked.

All the skin on my feet got cracked from the high frequency in writing that book. Really? Yeah. Cause you said. You were telling me before off camera that you wrote this book in Santa Monica in an apartment.

Rhonda Byrne
I did. Just a few miles from here with. My laptop on my lap. With your laptop in your lap on a small little apartment? Yeah.

Lewis Howes
Were you on the beach? Were you off the beach? Were you. What was your environment like off the beach? It was a very simple little corporate apartment.

Rick Rubin
The documentary had been released, and I was writing the book, and I had. It was just the perfect situation. I knew exactly everything that I wanted to say. It was really just rushing through me. And because of the frequency you had.

Lewis Howes
So your body was feeling. My body, really? Yeah. That is fascinating. After it, I was a wipeout.

You were, like, exhausted. You were, like, energetically drained. Energetically drained, yeah. And so then with each. Then with each book that I wrote was.

Rick Rubin
I tried to manage that more, you know, that I wasn't so wiped out now I could write a book, and not at all. Right. Yeah. But were you a writer before this? No.

Lewis Howes
Do you know what was this your first book? The secret is your first book, and you sold 34 million copies. That is crazy. I know, right? I remember when beyond words contacted me and said, we want you to do the sacred book.

Rick Rubin
Well, I knew there'd be a sacred book because I'd seen it in bookstores, in my mind, all around the world. In the front window, I'd seen it. I didn't know what it looked like, but I could feel the book. And I said, yes. I knew there'd be a secret book.

And I said, okay. They said, and we want you to write it. And I said, I'm not a writer. And guess what? I heard those words.

And I'm like, yes, I am. You switched it. Yeah. Because I'm not a writer means that you will not be a writer. Right.

And I'm like, yes, I am, because I can do anything that I put my mind to. Everybody can do anything. They put their mind to. And so I. And so I wrote, and I.

I was very specific. I wanted to write to people as though I was just talking to them and not, you know, any kind of incredible, huge words or anything like that. I just. I wanted it to be super, super simple because law of attraction was a hard concept to get your head around at that time. It's a lot.

It's understood a little more these days. And this is what I love about what you did, because you first said you saw it in your mind and you felt the book in bookstores, you felt it. So you were connecting the thought, the visualization of what you saw in your mind, in the feeling you had those two things connected. It sounded like. And this is where I think some people get wrong about the law of attraction, or the secret is they.

Lewis Howes
You had those two things, the thoughts and the feelings, as if it was already happening. But then you took action. You wrote the book. You didn't just say, it's magically going to, like, be in bookstores. There had to be some action somewhere, whether it was you or someone else.

Rick Rubin
Yeah, but I had the publisher come to me to say, you're going to write the book, you drew it in. So I attracted that. But do you know what? With that book, I honestly feel like I was just the stenographer. You were just.

That's why, in answer to your question, how did I manage all of that? Honestly, I never. I just felt like I was the luckiest person in the world to be a part of that journey. But I know without a doubt the universe was just there. It just, this had to come out into the world, and it was there to help at every turn.

Lewis Howes
If someone is applying these principles and think they're not drawing in the person, the publisher, the right person to hire the thing to support them in manifesting what they want, does that mean they're not ready for that thing to come out into the world? Is it not the right timing? Cause you could have wanted this 20 years prior, but it didn't happen then. It happened at the moment you were ready for it. It sounds like.

Rick Rubin
Yeah. So how can people let go of their frustration of really wanting something to happen now versus knowing when it's the right timing for it to come into the world? Right. So the difference is just simply belief. So you have to believe you have it already.

So if I explain what my belief was like, my belief was a notch above believing it had already happened. Mine was knowing it had already happened. What's the difference between believing and knowing? Because one, because knowing is the highest it can get. And it's actually knowing is beyond the mind, but you can manifest with believing, too.

So I didn't just believe this had happened. I absolutely knew it. Wow. And I knew it. And I knew what it was going to do.

And I.

How can I. It felt. I knew it so much that I felt like I had already lived the entire journey of making it and it coming out and that I had such a great time that I was reliving it. Oh, that's pretty cool. That's how, that's how it.

Lewis Howes
This is fascinating, what you just said. This unlocks something for me, the difference between believing and knowing. Yeah. I grew up in a religion, the religion of christian science, which is all about healing and applying healing, thinking and applying the mind to the material world. But really there is no material world anyways.

But one of the things that I would hear over and over again when I felt like something was off in my life or I felt like I was feeling a pain or something physical in my body was off out of alignment, we would have christian science practitioners, spiritual practitioners that would give us prescriptions. But they weren't medications. They were spiritual medications, essentially. Right. Gotcha.

And it was. And they were always called truths. And they would always say, know the truth. They didn't say believe this. They would say, know the truth.

And when you know it, it is true and it is a reality. And it was hard. It was confusing as a kid because I was like, well, but I feel this thing and there's this pain, but how can I know it? But what I'm hearing you say is believing can really help you in a big way. But knowing is what unlocks manifestation into another level.

Rick Rubin
Yeah. Knowing, it's just done. I mean, there have been times for everybody when they knew something. They absolutely knew something was going to happen before it happened. So let's say.

Lewis Howes
And how do they know that? Yes, how did you know that? And you don't know how you knew it? It's like an intuition or feeling or something. Yeah, right.

Rick Rubin
You knew it. Like somebody's having a baby and they don't know what sex it is, but you're like, oh, I know it's a girl. I absolutely know it's a girl. And everybody thinks you're just guessing like everybody else. No, you're like, I know it.

I know it's a girl. Or there's a spinning wheel and you all of a sudden you're like, I know it's going to be number eleven. I know it. And it's number eleven. But you knew it.

Absolutely knew it. How does that happen? Yeah, because it's above the mind. It's above the mind. So you, you definitely know it.

Lewis Howes
So that's crazy. So you don't have to be at knowing to manifest. You just have to be believing. And might I just say that you just have to be more believing than not believing. So that person who's not, they're waiting and it hasn't manifested and they're here and here.

Rick Rubin
The difference is they're not believing. It has done already.

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What's your thoughts on manifesting and manifesting something you want and alchemizing it into the world? Do you believe in manifesting? Do you believe in a, you know, artist should be thinking in that way, or what's your thoughts on it? I believe in it a million percent. It's something that I've experienced before I knew what it was.

Jen Sincero
So when I say it's like.

Lewis Howes
I. Feel like it has to do with the purity of the intention behind what you're doing. If your intention is pure and you're doing it for the right reasons, it seems like things tend to work out and that ends up being a manifestation mindset. But it didn't start for me that way. It just was like, I really believe in what I'm doing.

Jen Sincero
I really care about it. I want to be the best it could be for me, and I'm excited to share it. And the results have shown me that you can manifest things. It happens, but I'll say when I do it, it's never based on the outcome. Ooh, what do you mean?

I'm never asking for a result. What are you asking for? I'm asking for to. To rise to the occasion to make the best thing that I can for the thing that I make to be great. Great is a vague word.

I don't know what great means. I came to realize recently what great means, but I didn't know. Most of my life I was aiming for great, but I didn't know what that was. And I've come to realize that great means, it's. It's a devotional.

It's a devotional kind of greatness. It's a gift to the universe. It's a gift to God. Wow. If you're making.

If you're making a gift to God. There's no greater. You can't put more into it than that. You know you can't. What about the single.

What about. What about what someone's going to say who has anything to say? If we're making a gift for God, that there's. You're putting all of your purest intention into this thing for the universe. Wow.

That's where it's at. I didn't know that. I came to realize that recently, again, my word was greatness. Greatness. That was the word of what I was shooting for, but I've come to realize what it is.

Lewis Howes
Wow. You have a whole, you know, kind of section about greatness and success in the creative act, a way of being which is which. I loved your explanation in there. That is fascinating. So, greatness for you, what I'm hearing you say, is a pure gift of yours to God.

Yes. And it's a gift of yourself to God. It's like, this is the best I can do. This is my offering. This is what I have to offer.

If you think of a formula for manifesting as an artist, what would that formula be? I don't think there's a formula. Is there an art to manifesting? I don't know. I think it sounds like a shortcut, and I don't think there are shortcuts.

Jen Sincero
I think it's always a version of doing the work, of finding your way into what it is that the universe wants you to do and then really dedicating yourself. How do you know what the universe wants you to do and when to do it? The right timing, because you could be like, I have this idea for this thing. Maybe it's the right time now. Maybe it's 510 years away from now.

Lewis Howes
How do we really tap into that knowing? I think it's situational, and I think, again, if you're tapped into the universe, it tells you, it directs you an example. I may have three different ideas that I'm excited about, and I kind of get them all going, and then one of them just seems to take off on its own, and one of them, no matter how hard I work on it, it never seems to come together. Can't find the right collaborators. Impossible.

Jen Sincero
Some obstacles in the way. When that happens, I feel like it's the universe saying, now is not the time. Interesting, because, you know, I love this. And I also hear the other side of the, I guess the coin where, you know, I don't know if, you know, Ryan holiday. The obstacle is the way is his kind of stoic.

Lewis Howes
Philosophy of, like, when the obstacle is there and presents itself, and you also feel like this is something you want to do. Like, you've got to kind of go through that pain and, you know, to overcome it. That is part of it. I'm not saying to turn away from the obstacle, but I'm saying when the obstacles become insurmountable consistently, and there's another path, right. That's going smoothly, and you feel the same about both of them, you know.

Go for the effortless way. Yeah, well, pay attention. See, when. When is the universe giving you a push? When is the.

Jen Sincero
When is the wind hitting your sails the right way? There's something to it. I would never suggest not fighting through the work. It's. It's.

It's grueling no matter what. It's grueling no matter what. That said, sometimes it feels like now's not the time. It's like all. Everything you throw at it gets deflected.

Lewis Howes
Right. But this other thing is guiding you. Taking on its own life. Earlier, you asked about what I perceived to be a shortcut. And a shortcut is how little can I get away with doing.

Jen Sincero
And I think that the real question is, how much more can I give to the thing I'm making? What else can I give to it? And thinking in terms of how much more can we do? Not how much less can we do? It's not about shortcuts.

It's not about getting it done. It's not about a four hour workweek. I love to, you know, I loved it, but that stopped. It's like, whatever it takes for it to be all it could be commitment and total commitment, and dedicating your life to making the best things you can. Whatever it is.

Lewis Howes
Yeah. That's beautiful, man.

And so do you. So you think that as artists, we should be thinking about manifesting, but not in the terms of doing less, but putting the maximum into making it great. Doing anything that's within our power. If it doesn't have to make sense, nothing has to make sense, you know? Could be when I wear these purple socks, I can write a better song.

Jen Sincero
Great. Doesn't matter. Don't question it. Just do whatever works. Do it.

Lewis Howes
Is it really art if you're making money off of it? Absolutely does it? Doesn't matter. It's not about the outcome. That's what I'm saying.

Jen Sincero
Like, you, if you don't make money, or if you do make money, that has nothing to do with the art. Art is the art. And then whatever happens after happens after. If you make something that you love, I know if I make something I love, if more people like it, that's only a good thing. Now, I wouldn't change a word of it for someone else to like it.

Do you know what I'm saying? It's like I make the thing I love and then present it to the world. And then if the world likes it, great. And if more people like it than less better. Why not?

We're sharing something we love, something we think is beautiful. So the more people who embrace it, but again, I would never change it for anyone else because that's not what it's about. It's not about that. Right. With the artists you've worked with that you knew before they were global successes or their art, their music, or, you know, was known by many.

What did. You see became their biggest challenge once they became extremely successful? Because a lot of artists, I would think, want their art to be liked and listened to by people. They want to make a living and more people like it. Typically, that's a good thing.

Lewis Howes
Typically. But sometimes we see artists who have this incredible rise of success and then seem to struggle with whether, whatever, depression, anxiety, maybe the pressure. Can I do this again? Will I be able to have these many hits again? What is the biggest challenge you see with artists becoming successful?

Jen Sincero
Probably the biggest one is nobody prepares you for success, and you may have a dream of what it's like, and you may think the success is gonna fill some hole you have in your soul and then the success, and you work your whole life for the success that's going to fill the hole. And finally you get the success and the hole's the same, and it's, it creates hopelessness. Wow. Because you always, you're working towards this goal that's going to fix the problem, but it's, the goal doesn't fix the problem. It, I would say I can't, I can't, I can't say never, but I would say almost never fixes the problem.

Lewis Howes
What fixes the problem for people? It's something else. It's something inside themselves. It's something inside themselves. So do you think success can almost hurt someone more than before they have it, after they have it?

Jen Sincero
It just depends on the person's temperament. For some people, being famous is the greatest thing. It's all they ever wanted. And for some people, they become famous, and it's the worst nightmare. That's not what they wanted.

They miss their privacy. They miss their anonymity. They miss being able to go and do whatever they want and not be singled out or pointed to or talked to or even if people are nice, like, it's a different. It's different. And no one teaches you how to do that or you want to go do something with your family.

And then there are photographers there, and it's very awkward. What advice do you have for people that want to be famous? Success is one thing, but fame is another thing, and they don't always happen together. For someone that wants to be famous, what advice would you have for them? I don't know.

I would say, I would look at why that is. I would maybe see, you know, consider therapy. Have you ever done therapy yourself? I've done, yeah, I've done all kinds of therapy. What has been the biggest lesson you learned through therapy for you?

I learned how to express my feelings clearly. Like when I. The first time I went to therapy, I didn't even know how to talk. I didn't know how I felt about anything. How old were you then?

Maybe 26. So you learned how to express your feelings then? Yes. And to. Not only, yes, express them, but also to actually feel them in myself, to understand, not just feel, like, blocked off or frustrated or what's beneath it, what's actually going on.

Lewis Howes
And what is the biggest lessons that meditation or meditation practices has provided for you? It provides a quiet space where the chatter, you realize that your thoughts are not you. And that left to your own devices, there'll be a lot of voices in your head just going all the time. And they're not you, and they don't mean anything, and they're really repetitious and they're not working in your best interest. So if your thoughts aren't you, then what are you?

Jen Sincero
I suppose you are the unchanging part of yourself that's always there from probably from the time you're born till the time you die, and maybe before and after. It's the.

It's what's really inside. It's not.

It's not changeable. It's what you came with.

Lewis Howes
It's not the thinking mind. It's almost being the observer of the. Thoughts, the one who sees the thoughts. That sounds right. Yeah.

Observing good thoughts. Thank you. Yeah, that's what I was hearing you say. When do you feel the most loved, Rick? I would say in general, I feel loved.

Jen Sincero
It's a good feeling. I feel spiritually connected, and that gives me a great feeling of peace. Where do you think you'd be in your life if you weren't a meditator? And where do you think you'd be if you allowed yourself to play with drugs and alcohol?

Yeah, I can't really predict, I would say meditation. Without meditation, I don't know who I would be. It's such a big part of who I am informed. So many. Everything.

My understanding of the world is based on learning to meditate when I was young, so I don't know who I would be without that. Do you think you would have as much internal harmony and peace and external success without meditation? No, certainly not internal peace. I don't know about success. I wanted to ask you a question about comparison.

Lewis Howes
You know, you mentioned the. The NBA basketball player needing to post more on social media based on what their team or the coaches, or maybe not the coaches, but maybe the general managers wanted them to do with. With artists. I see a lot of people competing and comparison being in comparison versus just sharing their truths in an authentic way. And sometimes on social media, people are vulnerable because it gets attention, and then they're over vulnerable, and then that becomes a game in itself.

But in a world where everything is over saturated seeming and there is a lot of competition for attention, how can an artist stay true to their inner voice and not be in comparison, but be willing to collaborate and also see success in others and be okay with it? Yeah, I think. I think staying out of it, you know, like, not participating in that game, that's. It's someone else's game. That's someone else's game.

Jen Sincero
I would suggest play your own game. I can remember having a conversation with a big. One of the biggest artists in the world who described an album that they were gonna make, and. And I had just seen them play in a stadium full of people screaming and crying, and it was not Paul McCartney.

And the album that they were describing was one that none of those 70,000 people screaming and crying wanted to hear. It was clear. It was clear to me. And I remember saying, that's not your hand like you play when you're playing poker. It's not.

You can't just play any cards. You play your hand based on the cards you've been dealt. So depending on the artist you are, like, it'd be like, there was a time, I think, when Metallica felt like, we don't really want to be a heavy metal band. We want to be a pop band, because pop bands were what's popular, and we have reached a ceiling. Being a heavy metal band, that did not go well, that was a bad idea.

They weren't playing their hand. They weren't. They weren't embracing Metallica. And I think if you embrace your part, it's your best chance. Being true to yourself, not saying, oh, well, those people over there are getting popular doing this other thing.

I don't really like it, but it's really working for them. Maybe I could try that recipe for disaster. So don't chase something that's not your hand. No, but it sounds like, correct me if I'm wrong, you know, the example I'm thinking of is, like, lady Gaga came onto the scene doing, I guess, pop music and became very popular, but then said, hey, I want to do this more kind of jazzy, bluesy, like, Tony Bennett thing. She was being true to herself, and.

Lewis Howes
That'S what I want to do. And I don't care if anyone likes it perfect, but it's what I want to do at this season of my. Life, true to herself. And it may lose money, but she. Was not doing it because I think people like this, this is working over here, so I'm gonna try to catch their heat.

Jen Sincero
She was not doing that. She probably knew people wouldn't like it. Only a small. She didn't care. Yes, she didn't care.

That was true to herself. This is what she wanted to do, and she did it. Wow. Were you in touch with her at all during that season, or. I can't remember if we talked in that.

Yeah. I'm curious, but that's. I'm curious if she's just said, hey, I'm going to do this, and this is my thing, and. For sure, that's pretty cool. Yeah.

No, I love it when an artist does something unexpected, whether it works or not, you know, it's like, it's. They're being true to themselves. Right. They get to be a better artist doing that. Whereas the other example is someone, you know, whether it's Metallica or whoever, is, like, chasing a bigger audience or something.

Lewis Howes
Now, if that's true to them, that music, then there's an audience there. Go for it. Absolutely. Yeah. But it's also something about staying true to yourself in terms of if you come up making a certain kind of music and you get popular making that music, a feeling of, well, this is all anybody wants from me, so even though I don't care about it anymore, I have to keep doing it.

Jen Sincero
That's a disaster as well. Right? That doesn't work.

Lewis Howes
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Visit betterhelp.com lewistoday to get 10% off your first month. That's better. Help. Help.com l e w I s who has been the most musically gifted artist that you've been able to work with, or maybe a few people that you're just like. They were so musically, like, talented and gifted.

It was just. There'd been a lot. There've been a lot I can say the first time I was in the studio with Carlos Santana and he started playing guitar, it felt like this is coming from another planet. Or John Frusciante, when he plays from the guitarist and the Red Hot Chili Peppers. When he plays guitar, it's a transcendent experience.

Spiritual. Yeah. And then there's a drummer named Chris Dave who's. Best drummer I've ever heard. And no matter what he plays, anything he plays is the greatest thing you've ever heard.

Jen Sincero
The simplest thing. He can make anything interesting, just the way he plays it, not the parts. Doesn't have to be complicated. Doesn't have to be. Look at me.

Just the touch, the feel, the tone is miraculous. Something you said before is the only goal is to be the best version of ourselves.

Lewis Howes
Is there anything blocking you from becoming the best version of yourself, moving forward? I don't think so. Yeah. I wouldn't say I'm there. Right.

Jen Sincero
But I'm always striving, always anything I can do to get closer, I'll do. Wow. Yeah. You're. You're willing to learn something new.

Lewis Howes
You're willing to try something on or change anything. Right. What do you think is the best habits that an artist can have, that maybe you have individually, but also that you see in other artists? I would say dedication to the craft, whatever. Whatever their craft is, dedicating themselves to it, taking it very seriously and being free to play in it.

Jen Sincero
You know, like, taking it seriously at the time. At the time when it warrants being taken seriously and having fun and being free in a play way to allow the thing that's worthy of being taken seriously to appear. Right, right. Taking it seriously and also allowing yourself to play in it as well. Yeah.

The play always is where it starts. It starts in this playful way where nothing is serious and there are no stakes, and then through that, something appears. And then in order to get that into condition, to share, there's a grueling effort. Yeah, take that seriously. And sometimes it's.

Sometimes you do a grueling effort, and then you realize, oh, that thing that happened the first day, that's the best version of it. But you don't know that until you've maybe banged your head against the wall for six months working on it, and then you realize, you know what? That first five minutes was the best. That was it. You can't know that until you go past, you know, you have to work past it to see, this was the one.

Lewis Howes
This is the best version. How often is it? The first version is usually the best for you. I'll say. The first version is often, if it's not the best, it's very instructive and holds a magic in it that is to be retained no matter what else changes.

Jen Sincero
You know, a big part of it is just not screwing up what's good. Not messing it up? No. There are all these stories of, you know, the demos being better than the album. It's easy to not know why something is good.

You know, you make a demo, and you think, okay, now when I get the professional musicians to play it, it's gonna be great. It's gonna be that much better. Maybe yes, maybe no. We don't know. We never know.

We never know what's gonna happen when we do anything. Yeah. So to stay neutral and to keep every iteration along the way and be willing to look back after you just spent months refining something to then say, you know what, it was better three months ago. Throw that all away. Wow.

Lewis Howes
What was the book that really inspired you the most? The science of getting rich, by Wallace waddles. I mean, not only because it's, like, this big, because I'm super impatient, but, I mean, it's super cryptic. It's like it's all about the universe being a thinking stuff. And when you impress your thoughts into the thinking stuff, it becomes real and material world.

Rhonda Byrne
And I just. I just. It really, really, really spoke to me. I've read it hundreds of times. Really?

Yes. Yeah. What was the biggest takeaway from that book? So happy you asked, because I talk about this line all the time, is to think what you want. To think is to think the truth, regardless of appearances.

So this is everything, right? So mindset is everything. So regardless of appearances, regardless of the fact that I'm living in a garage, in an alley, driving a car with no grill, like, those are the appearances. But to think what you want, and I think the want is so key, too, because that's your authenticity. That's not like thinking what other people think you should do and how you should live your life, to think what you want, the purpose that you were put on planet Earth to live out, that's the truth.

That is the truth. So your desires are the truth, not what's physically around you. Wow. So how do we know that we are in harmony and congruency with our desires? That it's for something not just selfish and self serving by itself or ego driven, but more, I don't know, driven by something greater, you know?

Lewis Howes
Because if someone says, well, I want to make a lot of money, or I want to make $100,000 in a year, or 500,000 or whatever it is, or millions. How do we line up our desires with our authentic selves so that we don't hurt ourselves in the process of making money? Or it become overwhelming, daunting, or draining? I think you always come back to, is it fun? Does it give me energy or deplete my energy?

Rhonda Byrne
And does it have meaning? Those are the three things that I'm really living my life by these days. And I think that if you're in alignment with those three things and other things, certainly, but those are sort of my big three. Is it fun? Does it give me energy and does it give me meaning?

Yeah. And is it meaningful? Yeah. Is it meaningful? Yeah.

Lewis Howes
I like that. Yeah. And where were you at 39 doing things that weren't fun, that drained your energy and they were giving meaning? Yeah, pretty much. I mean, I was a freelance writer hustling my butt off.

Rhonda Byrne
And then, like, when I really did the math, I was, like, the amount of time I spent hustling for this gig, and they don't pay that well. Like, magazine articles. Come on. I was making, like, I was probably losing money, quite frankly. So, yeah, no, there was none of that.

It was not fun. It was exhausting. It had some meaning, but you gotta get all three, you know? Yeah. Or at least start working towards it.

Lewis Howes
Cause you may not be able to at this season, but you gotta focus on, can I get one? Can I get one? And is it leading in the direction of something that is fun that is gonna give me energy and has meaning? Cause you're right. Like, when you're building a company or when you're doing something, like, it is exhausting.

Rhonda Byrne
But if it's still exciting and fun and has meaning, then, yeah, yeah. It doesn't get to be a picnic all the time. When was the biggest aha moment for you then? Like, was it after you made a certain amount of money or a client paid you something? Or was it just a feeling you had, like, releasing all of it in the process of working?

Lewis Howes
Like, when was that moment where you're like, I'm actually emotionally and mentally free around the idea of money? Oh, interesting. Maybe I'm not abundant, I will tell you. No, I actually did. And I did put it in.

Rhonda Byrne
You are a badass. I put it in one of them. It was when I had. Oh, my God, it was such a cool moment because money is currency and currency is energy, right? So we're really going to get woo woo with the money.

Like, really shifting the mindset. Around money. And I bring me back to my story if I go off on a tangent, because I'm about to go off on a tangent, I want to remember, but I. Money is currency, and currency is energy. Yes, money is currency.

Currency is energy. And I've had so many clients that have told me, and it's happened to me, too, where they manifest when they get into the meditation and they start to raise their frequency, and they focus on the amount. The exact amount comes in from outer space that you didn't even think of. And so my story is around that, where I was working with my coach, and we were really going to shift my money reality. And so she's like, you know what amount of money would be really great for you to make right now?

Like, what would have a lot of meaning? And I was like, $10,000. Cause I'm $10,000 in debt on my credit card, and I hate being in debt. She's like, perfect. And so she's like, okay, so how soon are you gonna make it?

And she goes, you know, like, about a week, two weeks? And I was at the time making, like, 30 grand a year. And I was like, my God, if I made 10,000 in a week, that would be incredible. And I was like, but you know what? I gotta do it in two days because I know myself, and I will keep myself in that frequency.

Like, I'll lose steam and I'll decide that, like, nah, it's not. I can't do it or whatever. Like, I knew that the stuff would start creeping back in, so I was like, all right, ten grand in two days? She's like, great. Okay, so how are you going to do it?

At the time, I had this little online coaching business that I had just started coaching writers, and I said, I'll get three private clients, blah, blah, blah, blah. So then we're putting all the pieces in place. And then she's like, okay, and is there anything else? And I was like, well, you know, there was this guy that I was coaching years ago. He was my first private client.

I was charging him, like, $15 an hour, and I was like, I could also call him and see if he wants to work with me again. And she's like, okay, great. And we're still on the phone. And I checked my email, and he has written me. I have not thought of this man or communicated with him in years.

Rick Rubin
Email. He's like, you know, are you still coaching? Can you help me? When can we start? Wow.

Rhonda Byrne
And so she's like, okay, here's what we're going to do. We're going to put together a $10,000 package for him, and you're going to sell it to him right now. Holy cow. I know. And I was like, $10,000.

I was charging him $15 an hour. I was. And I really adore him. He's such a special person. And I was like.

Felt like a greedy pig. Blah, blah, blah. All the things. Fraud complex, gigantic imposter syndrome. Oh, beyond, beyond.

And so she's like, and what we'll do is we'll put together a $15,000 package and a ten. So the ten looks cheap. And I was like, I can't do 15. She's like, all right. Twelve.

Pain in my ass. Did a twelve. Sent it to him and literally wanted to throw up. I was just like, if he. Because I really cared about this guy.

He bought the twelve. Holy cow. I know. You're like, I should have made it 15. I know.

Exactly. I know. Well, here's the thing. You know, it's not like you were charging him 12 hours on an hour. Obviously, you created a position, packaging of services that would over deliver, that would serve him a big way.

I worked with him for five years after that. Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's not like I'm just gonna charge some number and give very little. Oh, no.

Lewis Howes
You made sure that the value was there. Totally. How did you learn to package and position your value to be able to charge for what you wanted? My coach helped me put it all together, but then I had to rise to that frequency. And I'll tell you, you know when you're charging something that scares the out of you, you show up with your a plus game.

Rhonda Byrne
Like, and he did, too. Like, it was a lot for him, too. We knocked it out of the park. Cause you pay attention to what you pay for. Yes.

Lewis Howes
Right? Yes. Yeah, totally. You'll rise the occasion. Like, I gotta focus.

Rhonda Byrne
Yes. I gotta show up on time. I'm gonna deliver the results on time. Absolutely. Give my best here.

Yep. Interesting. So now here's. I'm curious about the next thing. Was that everything did the story.

Lewis Howes
First off, I wanna make sure I get. Yeah, okay. Money is currency, and currency is energy. I'm curious about the next thing. So once this happened and you sold a $12,000 package, and you were like, this is crazy.

And this is more money than I've ever made in my life, essentially, in two days. Did you fall back at any point, or did you stay focused? Oh, interesting. Cause sometimes oh, sure. People get an opportunity and they get excited, and then, well, I tried it again.

It didn't work. So maybe this is a fluke. Maybe this was a one time and the thermometer goes back down to what they're comfortable or familiar with. Very common. Very common.

Rhonda Byrne
I did not. But only because I continued to get coaching, and I got bigger and bigger and bigger packages. I mean, I was paying six figures by the end, 100 grand for, like. A year of coaching or. Wow.

So I just, because I knew myself, I was like, I am rickety in this whole sort of wealth consciousness department. So I knew that I had, it's like getting a personal trainer, right. So I just kept investing in the coaching, and now. Now I'm good. But I do still have to work at it.

I mean, it's different levels. It's different levels. You know, if you're comfortable at this level, but if you want to break through. Exactly. Do something you've never done, you've got to have a different frequency still, right?

Exactly. Yep. There's always more growth to be had. Do you feel like you're kind of at, like, a block right now? Because, again, you've sold, you know, I don't know, five or 10 million copies of your books.

Lewis Howes
You've got coaching program, you've got all these core success, financial freedom, all these different things. But is there, like, a level you've reached that you feel like, okay, well, can I break through this? This is so much now, and I feel abundant, but could you break through? If I could decide what I want the next thing to be yet I'm still in that sort of incubation period of, like, what would be fun, give me energy and have meaning. I'm getting there.

Rhonda Byrne
Like, I definitely feel like I'm getting there. And I'm doing a lot of things that meet those requirements in the meantime. But it's not the biggest. What's your biggest fear or insecurity around money right now? That I don't know what to do with it when I make it.

Like, I'm good at making it. My bookkeeper called me one day, and she's like, would you please just open a savings account at your bank? Because I had, like, a million dollars in my checking account. This was a while ago. I finally got my.

So I've hired financial plan. Like, I've hired people who, grown ups who know what they're doing with money, but, like, I'm teaching myself about it, but I find it boring. I find investing boring and confusing. And out of my league. So luckily, there are amazing people who know what they're doing.

So I have finally gotten that team together. Gotcha. And there is a little tiny part of me, if I gave it any attention, that is a little scared it's all gonna go away. Really? Yeah.

But I don't. I'm not. It's not that bad. And I probably should not even speak it out loud. Right?

Lewis Howes
Right. Yeah. Well, you're being honest about it. I think there's one thing about speaking it out loud so it doesn't happen, but another thing about saying it so it doesn't have power over you. Right?

Rhonda Byrne
Ew. Yeah. You know, it's like, afraid of it. Like you're afraid to have the conversation around money. Yeah.

Lewis Howes
I'm all believer. Like, don't speak into something you don't want to happen. But I think when I started talking about my fears and my shame and my insecurity, it actually felt like the poison was coming out of me. And now I could see it outside of me, or I could have a conversation with it as opposed to it being in me, afraid to talk about. And then I could get coaching about it, and then I could let me create a game plan.

Okay, well, I'm afraid of it, but now I have a coach to help me, you know, invest it the right way and whatever I need to do. Yeah. You know, so. Yeah. As opposed to ignoring it and just.

I hope I don't lose it, but I don't want to speak about it. Right. That's a good point. That is a good point. Okay, I'll tell you another one.

What's the other one we're airing out? The other one is that I'm going to make too much of it, and I won't. And it is. It's kind of like the same as the first one, but I won't know what to do with it. Like, I'm scared of it coming in too fast and too much because it's going to bury me alive, almost.

Rhonda Byrne
Yeah, I know. I know. And so this is why. So I bury me alive? Kind of, yes.

Lewis Howes
Why would money bear you alive? Just telling you what I. Well, this is the interesting thing, Jen. I think it's powerful that you're talking about this because there's different levels of insecurities or fears at the stages of money we make. And when I was broke on my sister's couch, I had a lot of fear and insecurity, uncertainty of the future.

And then I remember one day I made $6,200 in an hour doing, like, a live webinar, selling a program. This was in 2009. Okay, well, there was, like, courses and webinars, all this stuff. And I go, I'm the richest man in the world with $6,200. Now, I had to split that with the person who promoted this training for me, but I still felt like $3,100 in an hour.

I go, I could do this every day for the rest of my life. Right. Cause I was sleeping on my sister's couch. But there was still. I never made six figures, and so there was still a challenge, like, how do I do this and how do I manage it?

And I understand it. And now taxes, what all my money's gone from. I just made money. I have zero again. And this fear of, like, this tax thing.

And then you get to the next level and the next level and next level, and I just think there's different challenges or things we get to overcome at every level of money as well. Sure. Yes. You know what I mean? New level, new devil.

Right? Is that right? Yeah. So one of the fears is, will the money bury me alive? Yeah.

Why do you think that is? Like, gosh, why do I think that is? I think it's my insecurity about not knowing what to do with it. When I had very little of it, I could manage it. Right.

Rhonda Byrne
That was easy. And then as I started getting more and more. And so I do have pieces in place, but I've opened, I've hired a new financial team so I can make, like, build the nest, and it will come because I was like, if I don't take care of this, I will literally block it. I will energetically block it if I'm scared of it coming in and think it's going to bury me alive. Like, that is not a abundant mindset, you know?

Lewis Howes
Sure. So, yeah, so I just created the nest. So now ring it on universe. Right. Right.

So now you can. You have. You have a foundation for it to come in? Yeah, yeah. So it's not scary anymore because I know where it's going to go.

Rhonda Byrne
Yeah. But I realized that I was just like, wow, I am kind of scared of it coming in too much. I know. It's interesting, isn't it? Yeah, I think it's fascinating.

Lewis Howes
I think we all get to experience at different levels how to break through otherwise. Wouldn't it be interesting if it was just. I don't know. There's no obstacle. What do you think are the key things that abundant mindset people around money do differently than scarcity?

Mindset people around money, if you had to say three or five kind of key things, they.

Rhonda Byrne
Appreciate it. As you said, that is a biggie. They appreciate it and they speak about it as they love it. They're not weird about it. They're also generous with it.

Because when you pinch yourself off from giving, that is sort of a subconscious way of saying there's not enough to go around and it's not going to. I'm not in the flow. So when you don't give generously, it's because you're scared that it's not going to come in anymore. They take risks. You know, you got to take risks.

You are where you are because you've been doing what you've been doing. So if you want to change your life, you've got to do stuff you've never done.

What else? Wealthy people, they learn about money. You focus on money. That was such a big thing for me, too. When I was broke, I never wanted to think about money.

I was all about writing songs and doing much more noble things. But when you're broke, all you think about is money. Like, I don't really think about money that much now that I have it. But every single decision you make when you're broke is about, I have enough. To pay for that.

Exactly. Can I afford it? What happens if I don't have, right. You wake up in the first thing in the morning in a panic because you got to pay your bills. So you're always thinking about money.

So it is really just sort of getting in the flow with that and just, you know, being on good terms with it and focusing on it and, you know, how are you going to make it, like, being realistic about your income streams and, you know, and if you want to make it, you've got to coax it in, you know, give it. Yeah, I'm curious about this. Okay? You, you're a starving artist. You wanted to do noble things, which about art and making art and all these different things.

Lewis Howes
What would have happened if someone would have said, jen, you know what, I love that you're an artist. I love that you have this, you know, passion for art and you want to keep doing this. And this is where you've been for 40 years, and we don't want you to change. Here's 100 grand a year for the rest of your life. Don't worry about money.

Up to 100 grand. What would that have done to you if someone would have given you 100 grand a year and you would have just been like, okay, I'm gonna write and do whatever I want. And how do you think it would have been mentally, emotionally, spiritually, versus you having to risk emotionally and mentally, you getting to heal, let go, overcome, challenge yourself into asking for money, into becoming something greater than that limiting belief. Where do you think you'd be now? Probably would've spent it on beer.

Rhonda Byrne
Honestly, back in those days. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I wasn't. You're absolutely right.

It's a frequency, you know, it's like, it's like.

I don't know. I mean, I always, I always had. I guess I'm going to say gall. That's not the right word. But I did do a lot of stuff that was pretty edgy and I pushed the envelope a lot.

So I may have gotten there, but I don't think it would have been as exciting as it was to do it myself. There really is. You do grow. And they say starting your own business is the best personal development course you can partially do. Because all your stuff comes up.

Right. All of it. So relationship training, it's leadership training, it's inner child training. Everything totally misplaced. Totally.

So. So it wouldn't have been as satisfying. I don't think. I think I still would have done it though. Cause that is kind of my personality.

When I'm ready to change, I'm ready to change and I do it. Yeah. Yeah. So. But I think it wouldn't have been as glorious.

And I definitely, I probably wouldn't have written you are a bad. Which totally changed my entire life. So it changed yours but also changed other people's lives. Yes. So it's who you become, the lessons you learn, the wisdom you have.

Yes. To then be able to be of service and teach. Yeah. From your own experience. Exactly, yeah.

The book about me getting 100 grand a year just for being would not be that interesting to people. Right. Yeah. Right. That's interesting.

Lewis Howes
Asking the right questions can greatly impact your future, especially when it comes to your finances. So if you're looking for a financial advisor you can trust, certified financial planner professionals are committed to acting in your best interest. That's why it's gotta be a CFP. Find your CFP professional at let's make a planner. Sometimes it takes a different approach to help you unlock your true potential.

Rhonda Byrne
With Capella University's game changing flex path learning format, you gain relevant skills you can apply to your career right away, earn your degree from an accredited university, and be confident in the quality of your education. Imagine your future differently at capella.edu. Capella University is accredited by the Higher Learning Commission. Learn more@capella.edu accreditation. Yeah.

Lewis Howes
What has been the biggest lesson in the last ten years? Because that was ten years ago when you wrote, you are a bad. Right. And you've written two or three books since then, I believe. What has been the biggest lesson, three books since then?

Rhonda Byrne
Yeah. What has been the biggest lesson in ten years since you are a bad to now personally, physically and financially? Oh, man. Let me think. Okay.

The biggest lessons since I wrote you. Because when you get more money, more impact, more celebrity fame in an industry, people change around you. Some people don't. Some people do. You get to make different choices with your health, any positive or negative.

Right. You have more abundance to do bad things or good things, and you get to see how you show up emotionally, spiritually. Yeah. That's such an interesting question. You know, I definitely feel like since it came out and has had the success that I've gotten better and better, it really.

This sounds cold, but, like, not caring what other people think about me. Like, that is something that I'm really dedicated to right now, where it's like the one star reviews and the five star reviews, you know, it's like, believe me, I'm so grateful anybody reads the book. But the five star reviews are the real dangerous ones, right? Where you're just like, I'm so cool. People think I'm funny and smart, you know, really getting good inside.

Like, just being like, it doesn't matter as long as I think it's good and I think it's funny and I think it's helpful. That's it. And so that has been really important to me because it is weird. I mean, I'm sure you too, like, people know who you are, and it's like, it's a little uncomfortable sometimes. I mean, it's great too.

Like, I love meeting my readers, but it's just like, I can't get too wrapped up in their opinion of me because it's about my opinion of me. So that's been a really big one. So not letting the opinions of others be the opinions of you. About you. Right?

Yeah. Interesting. This really coming, the high hype and the low low? Yeah, definitely. Cause you hear a lot about the low lows.

Like, don't focus on the criticism, but you really gotta watch it with the five star stuff, too. That's interesting because then if it goes away, you're screwed, right? You're totally screwed. I mean, that's why so many celebrities wind up in rehab, you know, especially if you. I always think about this, too, that I'm so glad for me anyway, that it started when I was older.

Lewis Howes
If I was. Oh, man. If I was getting all these accolades, I would be such an idiot. I know. Like, no way.

Rhonda Byrne
Oh, I'm really great. I'm so grateful for all of it. My God. Okay, that's personally. What about biggest lesson financially?

Financially, I guess. I love giving money away. I really, honestly never thought I was that generous of a person, but I am. So I'm very happy to find that out about myself because I didn't really think that I was, but also that I was just making fun of this this morning with a friend of mine that I'm still kind of cheap with myself in ways I'm not great at. Like, I mean, I have a nice house.

I have a nice car. I certainly spend plenty of money on myself, but I can just be, like, I'm not good at being rich and, like, getting room service and, like, spending. I'm just. I'm still kind of, you know, the italian immigrant's daughter who sort of pays attention. So.

Not that that's bad, but it's interesting. I have a little bit of that in me. Although in the last couple years, I've started to learn how to take care of me, like, with travel and food and convenience and saving time. Convenience. Whereas for, I don't know, the first five years of my business, I was making money.

Lewis Howes
Right. It's like, not like I didn't have money, but I was so afraid to lose it. Also, I was just stacking it. Every time I travel, I would try to find, who do I know in this town that I can sleep on their couch? Yeah.

Rhonda Byrne
Isn't it funny? Cause I was like, I'm not gonna pay $200 a night for a room. What are you talking about? I can use that money, and I can put it somewhere else. And I was always like, how do I just get on the cheapest bus fare, right?

Lewis Howes
How do I get, like, the middle backseat on southwest? Like, how do I get the $39 to just sit there for 6 hours in the middle and just crammed, as opposed to convenience and saving time and having my health optimized and using it to do those things, but I was afraid to lose it. So it's just work, work, work to make it, but I was afraid to lose it for a while. Yeah. And also, like, the value, like, I still.

Rhonda Byrne
And I make myself do. But I hate paying for parking. I would rather drive. And we're talking, like, $2 at a meter. Like, I'm so weird about that.

Lewis Howes
I'm like, you'd rather roll on the block five times and try to find. A place to waste gas, waste my time. Like, it's so stupid, but I crack up. But I also have this thing where, like, I'll spend 60 grand to put solar on my house, but I won't spend $15 on a wooden spoon. Like, I'm just kind of funny catching yourself where you're.

Well, I think there's a. There's a. There's a power in being mindful with your money and being. I would call it frugal, I guess. Maybe in certain ways, but abundant in other ways.

Rhonda Byrne
Yes. Right. It's like, be abundant in certain ways, but don't just overspend on everything because you have the money. Yeah, I guess. I know.

So mindful of certain things, you know, at whatever level you're at, too, you know? Like, when you don't have money, you also don't want to be pinched off and stingy with it. Like, it really is about. This isn't just, you know, two people with money talking about it. It really is about figuring out where you're at and how to stay in that abundance mindset and in the flow and leaving an extra dollar when you tip or whatever, you know, but just really catching yourself when you're pinching it off.

Cause it doesn't matter how much we're talking about, but it's that pinching off. If money is currency and currency is energy and you're pinching it off, that is not too well for you. Not blocking it. What was the big lesson about relationships in the last ten years? Whether it be friend, colleague, intimate relationships.

Yeah. You know, that people are still really uncomfortable with money, and I do feel like it's being of service to talk about it freely and openly and joyfully. And it totally turns people off all the time. And close friends. Absolutely.

But taking a stand and doing it anyway. And really, like, I kind of do have to. I have to be a little careful because it can be braggy. But again, like, if I lost 100 pounds and I was telling you about losing 100 pounds, people would be happy for you. This is the same kind of thing.

Like, it's something that really is an achievement that helps me be healthy and happy. Yes. And why shouldn't I talk about it? And the fact that you're uncomfortable with it doesn't mean I shouldn't talk about it. Right.

And sink down to your level. Right. So that's been interesting. And I have lost friends over that. Absolutely.

Lewis Howes
Wow. It's interesting because we'll see on social media these physical transformations of people. Here was me six months ago. Here's me now. And you'll see a lot of people celebrating that, like, congratulations.

It's amazing. It's the encouragement. It's like, look what I was able to do. And I'm so proud of myself, and I wish more people would do that around money, too. Look, I was $30,000 in debt, and look at my bank statement.

Now I'm debt free, and I've got $1,000 in the bank. Oh, my God, whatever it is. And I think Dave Ramsey celebrates that for people in his kind of community, where it's like when they get out of debt, he brings them on the radio show and they kind of announce it. But I don't see this on social. Media that much because that's a safe space because everybody's listening to his show, is talking about money.

Rhonda Byrne
Yeah. You do it in the public space, you are going down. Yeah. Why is that? I don't really know.

I don't know. I think about this, too. How did that all get started? When did it become such a dirty thing? I'm sure it has to do with some kind of control.

Like, some people wanted to control something, so. Right. I'm curious about, you know, if you're down to go there about intimate relationships, how has making money impacted you intimately in relationship? I am definitely. That is my achilles heel right now.

So that. And it's been a little weird for me. Cause being a very. I have stories around being a very successful woman and how that's not so feminine and how. Yeah, there's a lot of stuff on that, so I'm.

That's the new frontier, which I'm super. Psyched about figuring it out. Yeah. What do you feel like is the biggest struggle around that? You know, is it my own beliefs around it?

Totally. Come on, now. I know all this. It's all the same thing, you know, but that's a deep one, and it's kind of a new one, you know, because. Because I haven't been a successful woman for a long time, and so it's interesting.

Lewis Howes
Wow. Yeah. So is this, like, people just are intimidated by you because you have money or what is that? That's what I think. Because men are supposed to be the provider, isn't supposed to be the providers, and then be more successful.

Rhonda Byrne
And I don't really even care about that, but I do care about somebody being at the same level of me spiritually. And sort of just, you know, just with what they're into and stuff like that. So that's really important to me. Interesting, because that might be a block for some women. Like, if I make more money, will I be in a great intimate relationship?

Lewis Howes
I think if I make more than my partner. Right. Well, the way that it's set up anyway, that is sort of it, you know, that men and, you know, so I just got to find a guy who's either as. Who's got really good wealth consciousness, who's as successful, who's totally out there. But it's my own story.

Rhonda Byrne
It's always your own story. Yeah. What would you coach another woman who. Says the same thing? Or who's like, they've got a, you know, a successful growing business, or maybe they're, you know, making a million dollars a year in their business or more.

Yeah. And they're like, man, I've been struggling because I haven't found a guy who's comfortable with me making this much. They feel like they can't add as much value to the relationship. Right. What would you say to that?

Well, of course, Lewis, I have had that client, because the second you have an issue, that client shows up. I don't know if you find, like, every time, because I'm doing this group coaching course and. Oh, yeah. Like, plenty of people in that group have asked me the very question. So it's super easy when it's.

Well, I know. I mean, I know the answer, but am I, like, really going to live? It is. Watch your thoughts. What are you believing about it?

What have you decided is true about you, about your environment, about the way the world works? Like, it's all your thoughts. Like, if you keep harping on, it's hard, he's not out there. I'm to this, I'm to that. Then that is the truth.

Lewis Howes
That's what you'll manifest. Are attracted to think. What you want to think is to think the truth. That's true. Yeah.

It's interesting because my girlfriend, I was telling you about her a little bit before. She's extremely successful in what she does. She makes a lot of good money, and I celebrate it. I'm like, yeah, awesome. For me, it feels great to have someone who's more energetically aligned or more of an equal match, even though my business does more than her business.

But she's making it killing in her own way, and I'm excited for her, and it doesn't make me feel like I'm not able to provide as much with her making good money. Also, for me, it doesn't affect that within me. But maybe 1015 years ago, it would have. Maybe I would have felt insecure or not enough because I hadn't worked on my stuff. Right.

So I think it's just finding, you know, someone who's in a linemate, who's a good match emotionally, spiritually, psychologically as well, who's done the work and doesn't find an intimidating. Exactly. I find it inspiring. I'm like, wow. And here's the interesting thing.

For me not to go off on this too much, but for me, something switched in the last, like, five to eight years where I had this kind of morbid thought where I said, okay, if I'm with a partner and I don't feel like she can be resourceful and I die, can she take care of my kids financially? It was kind of a morbid thought, but I was like, huh. And I struggled in the previous relationships that I was in, thinking, would they be able to financially figure it out if they didn't. If they didn't remarry? That's a great thing to think about.

If they didn't find another man to support them financially, if they didn't, you know, their parents didn't fund them. Right. Whatever happened, if I. We had kids, I died. Could they financially be resourceful and do things that would make our kids proud of them?

You know what I mean? And so, and that's my partner now. So it's like she is financially resourceful and creative enough to generate money if she needed to. Right. But I don't need her to anymore.

You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah. Anyway, something to think about there. But. So that's one of your blocks right now, one of your challenges.

Rhonda Byrne
Temporary block. Yes, we're releasing the block very quickly. Yes. I'm just airing all the laundry here. When I leave this room, that it all stays here.

Lewis Howes
Exactly. Yeah. We'll open the window so it goes somewhere else. Please get a fan. Yeah.

What is the question you get asked by your readers the most that you wish they truly could hear and believe the answer to? Oh, so many. Well, the one that I said about what do you do when the people closest to you don't support you? Another one is, how do you keep the motivation? Like, you know, we go to these seminars, we read books, we listen to the podcast, and we're all raring to go.

And then a month later, you go back and you're all. Exactly. Yeah. So how do you stay motivated? Yeah.

On your vision and on your growth journey. Well, I call it going to the spiritual gym. And you've got to have a spiritual gym practice because you do not get to work out physically and then stop going to the gym once you're in shape. So just because you got in shape at the seminar or listen to the podcast or whatever, you don't get to stop doing stuff. So.

Rhonda Byrne
And it doesn't. And, you know, everybody working so hard to start my business, I don't want another thing to do. So it's like, it can be 20 minutes, you know, working out for 20 minutes a day can do a lot of great things. So it's like spiritual gym workout. Meditate for 15, read a self help book for five.

Like, what music are you listening to? Who are you hanging out with? What makes you feel like you could flip over a car? Like, what are those things? And do them every single solitary day for 20 minutes.

It's not that big a WHOOP de do. You know, when you think about that, it's going to change your entire life, you know? So. And take it as seriously as anything else because that work will make everything else that you're taking seriously and trying to achieve so much easier. And, you know, I'm giving a lot of talks right now and the thing that I'm just so excited and I'm so excited to be speaking right now, too, because it reminds me, it's my spiritual gym, right?

Like, we all need it. So. But the thing about, because we are spiritual creatures having a physical experience, right? And if you, and like, instead of just giving it lip service and talking. Yeah, yeah, I know that.

But think about it. We are the universal intelligence that created everything that is, we are our thoughts, our universal intelligence, the stuff that created everything that is. Why are we not more stuck up? Why are we not feeling so powerful all of the time? If we're really going to believe it, if we're really going to go steroids on woo woo and go there and really, like, if you thought about that all day long, about your thoughts being, you know, when you're in alignment, not the garbage thoughts that you think, but when you get quiet and you tap into your inner yippee skippy, as I like to call it, and you're there and you're in the flow, it's like, it's so exciting.

Lewis Howes
I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's episode. With all the important links. And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally, as well as ad free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our greatness plus channel exclusively on Apple Podcasts. Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well.

Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review. I really love hearing feedback from you, and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward. And I want to remind you of no one has told you lately that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out there and do something great.

Rhonda Byrne
At Capella University, you'll get support from people who care about your success, from before you enroll to after you graduate. Pursue your goals, knowing help is available when you need it. Imagine your future differently at capella.edu. Here you are, bpms high. Sweat dripping, body moving, tongue panting.

Rick Rubin
You're working hard, real hard. And you're thirsty. You need vitamins, nutrients for peak performance and energy. And your plants do too. I mean, just look at the little guy.

Rhonda Byrne
Water soluble plant food from miracle grow is full of essential nutrients. Just a little scoop into your watering can and boom. Instant feeding and bigger, more beautiful plants. It's kind of like a sports drink for your plants. You may have to suffer from heat.

Rick Rubin
But your plants do not.

3 BIGGEST MYTHS to The Law of Attraction: Manifest Your Reality

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1: Introduction

2: Understanding Emotions

3: The Power of Joy

4: Beliefs and Manifestation

5: Practical Manifestation

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