7/9/24: Biden says he's staying in, Parkinson's conspiracy explodes, Trump softball interview

David Pakman
President Joe Biden is attempting to stop the discussion about whether he will drop out. It's not working, but he did write a letter indicating he's not dropping out. We were going to, we are going to take a look at the letter, and then I also want to talk about some of the aspects of it that make more sense and some that make less sense sense. President Biden sending this letter to fellow Democrats, and he says, now that you have returned from the July 4 recess, I want you to know that despite all the speculation in the press and elsewhere, I am firmly committed to staying in this race, to running this race to the end, and to beating Donald Trump. I have had extensive conversations with the leadership of the party, elected officials, rank and file members, and most importantly, democratic voters. I have heard the concerns people have, their good faith, fears and worries about what's at stake. I'm not blind to them. Believe me. I know better than anyone the responsibility and burden the nominee of the party carries, talking about how he previously carried it as well.

But he says that he is going to stay in. I can respond to all this by saying clearly and unequivocally, I wouldn't be running again if I did not absolutely believe I was the best person to defeat Donald Trump in 2024. We had a democratic nomination process, and the voters have spoken clearly and decisively. I received over 14 million votes, 87% of votes cast across the entire nominating process. I have nearly 3900 delegates, making me the presumptive nominee by a wide margin, adding, this was a process open to anyone who wanted to run. Only three people chose to challenge me. One fared so badly that he left the primaries to run as an independent. Another attacked me for being too old and was defeated. The voters of the democratic party have voted. So couple different things here.

First of all, upfront, some of the people who email me don't seem to realize I have no power over whether Biden stays, stays, or goes. Like absolutely none. All I can do here is talk about the dangers of Trump, and I don't want Trump to win. So this is a letter Biden wrote. A much like when I reported polling about Biden, this is the letter Biden wrote. I'm not a player in influencing any of the outcomes here.

The letter is definitive and one can make the argument, and we'll, we will see later what our panelists think. One can make the argument that it makes sense to be definitive at this point in time. The other thing I think is important to mention is that when Biden says only three people chose to challenge me.

You know, it doesn't really make a lot of sense. It's sort of like if I said if it weren't for Biden, Marianne Williamson would be the nominee. No, no serious candidate challenged Biden because Biden was the incumbent. If it weren't for Biden running, if it were an open primary, Marianne Williamson would not be the nominee. There would be other people running and they would have defeated the three people who did run. That's my belief. That's my opinion. But it's the one part of this letter that doesn't make a lot of sense. So we are going to continue now, you, you will see they are moving on from Biden, something with the brain.

They're moving on to Biden, Parkinson's. And we're going to get to that in a moment. But at least for the time being, Biden being definitive and saying, I'm staying in the race. The new Biden health story is about a Parkinson's expertise who visited the White House, according to some reports, 810 or twelve times. The implication is that President Biden has Parkinson's. We don't have evidence of that at this point in time, but we will address it substantively.

We can't ignore, we can't ignore that in 2016. They also were saying Hillary has Parkinson's. Just, it's, Hillary not having Parkinson's has no bearing on whether Biden has Parkinson's. But they did this with Hillary. It's important to mention the story in the New York Times and elsewhere is that a Parkinson's expert, a doctor, visited the White House eight time in eight months. The concern, of course, was, is that doctor visiting because there is something Parkinsonian happening with Joe Biden. We had questions about this during yesterday's press briefing with press secretary Corinne Jean Pierre. Here's how that went.

Karine Jean-Pierre
I'm not going to share people's names from here, but the president, I can tell you, has seen a neurologist three times as it's connected to the, to a physical that he gets every year that we provide to all of you.

David Pakman
That's a very basic direct question.

Karine Jean-Pierre
Wait a second.

Rachel Bitecofer
Or at least once in regards.

Karine Jean-Pierre
I just specifically. Hold on a second.

Cenk Uygur
You should be able to answer.

Karine Jean-Pierre
Wait, no, no, no.

Wait a minute.

Ed, please.

A little respect here, please.

So every year around the president's physical examination, he sees a neurologist. That's three times. Right? So I am telling you that he has seen a neurologist three times while he has been in this presidency. That's what I'm saying, I am telling you that he has seen them three times. That is what I'm sharing with you. Right? So every time he has a physical, he has had to see a neurologist.

David Pakman
This is the crux of what they are saying, that the visits, as far as Biden is concerned, were just a neurologist as part of his team for his annual physical. Now, three times in three years is different than eight times in eight months. And the White House subsequently releasing a letter which you can check out, which writes that this is not about Biden having Parsons Parkinson's, that this is a very well respected neurology consultant he visits. And the White House medical unit is in charge of many, many different people and oversees the health situations of many people. It's not just the president of the United States. So allegation they're hiding Biden Parkinson's defense. That's a doctor who consults with us. There's a thousand people that are sort of under the purview of care of the White House medical unit, and there's nothing to see here. Do I know for sure the answer? No, I don't. But here's what I can tell you. If President Biden has Parkinson's, so what? It makes no difference to me. It would do nothing to dissuade me from voting for him. The progression of Parkinson's disease and these related parkinsonian disorders, they really vary, but they are typically slow to progress in the early stages. The first three years, you're talking about stiffness and sometimes mild tremors, minimal impact on daily activities. Almost everyone in the first three years can perform whatever tasks they were previously performing. You then get into the middle years, three to seven years, where symptoms get worse.

It can take 15 years to get what would be called late stage Parkinson. So would it be a big story if the White House were hiding that Joe Biden is Parkinson's? It would. It would.

Does it have any bearing, any bearing on how I would vote in November?

Absolutely none. And as a reminder, they did Hillary Parkinson's as well. Now they're doing Biden Parkinson's. I don't know the truth. The White House has put out a statement, but it doesn't change that I'm voting Biden over Trump in November if those are the options, if this would even hypothetically change your vote. Well, I want to hear from you info at david Pakman.com.

don't forget that the best way to support the David Pakman show is by becoming a member, which gives you access to the Daily bonus Show, the regular show with no commercials. You also get access to our entire archive of every episode dating back a really long time and plenty of other awesome membership perks. Go to joinpakman.com joinpakman.com today I want to welcome to the show Rachel Bitticofer, political strategist, author of the new book hit em where it hurts, how to save democracy by beating Republicans at their own game. And Cenk Uygur, host of the Young Turks, author of the book justice is coming, and also a former candidate for president of the United States. I really appreciate both of you being here. I enter the conversation genuinely agnostic about is the best way to defeat Donald Trump, Joe Biden staying in the race or not? Half my audience is furious because I'm not taking one position. The other half is furious because I'm not taking the other position. I want to learn from the two of you and see if we can get some kind of answer here. Rachel, let me start with you. Help me make sense of it. Does Biden have a path to victory? Is he the strongest candidate to defeat Donald Trump in November at this point?

Rachel Bitecofer
Yeah. I mean, I'm going to come to the answer from political science background. I used to teach and lecture and research on presidential campaigns, including presidential nomination campaigns. So my focus is really focused on the structural complexity of switching our nominee in July.

Obviously, if it was a clean slate answer, is Biden our best candidate? Clearly not, right? I mean, I had two strategic objectives for the debate that I thought were both very critical. Number one, the Republicans had used social media effectively over four years to brand him as not all there or whatever. Dementia Joe. Right. And I said he needed to show in the debate that he is perfectly fine. Step one, fail. And then the second thing was that he needed to say the words Project 2025. Because the reality that I understand is that almost no americans that need to know what Project 2025 is, know what that is today. And until we have saturation of average swing voters in the swing states, people who don't read or watch news at all, they know what Project 2025 is. We're in dire straits. So I wanted Biden to achieve both of those strategic goals, and he did neither. Right?

For me, though, the replace Biden thing is flawed, or at least the premise of it is very, very dangerous, because when you talk about moving in the nominee, we have 159 field offices going in these seven swing states. There's eleven field offices operating right now in Virginia. The organizational advantage that the Biden campaign team had through the incumbency advantage was the one thing that, like, made me sleep at night, understanding that the polling over the summer would not reflect the vast majority of people who are going to vote because they do not pay attention to any politics and will not pay attention to it until after Labor Day. So it is very, the answer is, should we have a different nominee? Yes. In a perfect world, we would put a new nominee and everyone has their fill in the blank for that. And if it's not Kamala Harris, big problems, folks, because that's the sitting VP. You don't fit, you don't switch, switch over a sitting vp without isolating their voters. And in this case, of course, Kamala is the first female black president. So our vice president. So it would be a double whammy because it would isolate not just any voter, but it would be the core base voter of the Democratic Party. So it's very complex. The filing deadlines start in August. August 1 is the first filing deadline. It's for Pennsylvania. So we really only have a couple of weeks to sort it out. By the time the convention happens, most of the filing deadlines will have been passed. So it's something that either changes this week or it really is going to be very complex.

Donald Trump
Speaker one.

David Pakman
All right, let's hear from Cenk. So a few things there. Cenk, number one, you had previously mentioned to us, we were thinking of having this conversation a couple of days from now, and you said, I don't even think Biden will be in the race at that point. I'm curious whether you still feel that, number two, if there is a replacement, Rachel saying the only real choice is the vice president, Kamala Harris. Curious whether you agree on that. Feel free to respond to anything Rachel said.

Cenk Uygur
Yeah. So let's take it one at a time. So, number one, Joe Biden's going to drop out of this race. The only question is when. And so I need people to focus on how disastrous it gets the later it is. So in a sense, Rachel's right in that it gets harder and harder as we go along, as you hit those deadlines, as you hit the convention, pass the convention, you think it's not even possible. It is possible, but he would basically have to step down from the presidency, and he will. He will definitely step down at some point. Why?

Because first of all, his numbers are catastrophic.

So I appreciate that Rachel's honest and, and recognizes that he was a zombie in the debate. He was awful. Didn't make a single point that he needed to make against an incredibly weak opponent like Trump.

And so, okay, but the debate performance is just the indicator. It's like the tip of the iceberg that lets you know the iceberg is there, but it's not the iceberg. The iceberg is the numbers. But now there's a second iceberg, which is forces the hands of the Democrats, which I'll get to in a second. But the main iceberg is the underlying numbers. So, first of all, his top number is disastrous. New York Times and other places have him at losing by six.

This time in 2020, he was winning by nine, and he barely won the electoral college at that point. So that's a 15 point difference. He is a. He had a 52% approval rating back then. Right now, he has a 36% approval rating. That's 16 point difference. That is.

That is insurmountable. Totally, literally insurmountable, because it's never happened before in american history. No incumbent for any federal office has ever been in the thirties, this late in an election cycle, and come back to it, ever. The best politician that has ever existed has not been able to do it, let alone Joe Biden, let alone Joe Biden in this state. So it's over. He's definitely going to lose. So that's. .1. And so if you're blue Maga and you say, hey, I want to go down with the ship, and I love leadership, and I would rather obey and lose to Trump than defy leadership, uh, and have a chance of beating Trump. Okay, well, you know, you made that bed and you can lie in it. Uh, but I, unlike a lot of Democrats, actually really, really want to beat Trump. If you really, really want to be Trump, there's no argument for keeping Biden. None. But now the second iceberg is even more important, David, because, uh, the Republicans made one ad, and then they stop because they realize, oh, no, if we keep going, the Biden will withdraw. And they desperately want Biden to stay in the race because it's a guaranteed victory for them, and not just for Trump, but for all of Congress. Because the ad they made was against Bob Casey, and they had Bob Casey hugging Joe Biden and wearing a Biden hat. And they said, how long did Bob Casey know about Joe Biden's condition? But he lied to you, and he keeps lying to you to cover up for Joe Biden. Da da da da da da da. Those ads are super effective.

They're going to annihilate the Democrats in Congress. They're going to run that out against every democratic congressman and every democratic senator. And it's totally going to work. You know why? Because eight out of ten Americans think that Joe Biden is not mentally healthy enough to be president. So you're not going to convince eight out of ten Americans that these people aren't lying to cover up for Joe Biden there, because it's not just that Joe Biden's incredibly weak and he gets attached to the Democrats is already terrible, but it's that they're all part of a cover up while pretending and lying to the american people that Joe Biden is mentally healthy when eight out of ten Americans think that he's not. And if you're a blue maggot and you go, no, he. I heard from Joe Scarborough. He's a dynamo behind the scenes, and I believe he's great. Okay. It doesn't matter what you believe. This is what people have to understand. And this is why I said Trump would win in 2016. Even though I hate Trump. You can't judge it from your perspective. If you love Joe Biden, that doesn't matter at all. What matters is, is he going to win or not? What do the majority of Americans think? And now that jury's in eight out of ten, it's already over. So what will happen is if Biden stays as he is, the egomaniac narcissist that he is, and he's the mad king, and he burns down the Democratic Party, at some point, post convention, for example, they'll realize, oh, now all of our poll numbers are three to five points lower.

We're going to lose every purple state, every swing district, and we're going to lose some non swing districts, because now Biden's losing three to six non swing states. Then they're going to panic. Then they're going to throw Biden overboard, they're going to pay Kamala. And then at that point, you can't just say he's not the candidate anymore. He would have to step down from the presidency. Then they panic and put in Kamala Harris as the president. And Kamala Harris is the candidate. But by that time, it's probably way, way too late. So pick your poison.

If you don't push him out now, you are risking the biggest disaster the Democratic Party has ever seen in our lifetime. Speaker one. Okay, Rachel, so I'll get to Kamala Harris in a second. Go.

Rachel Bitecofer
Yeah.

David Pakman
So? So, Rachel, I mean, weigh in on the math that Cenk is laying out, which is plus nine four years ago, minus six, now, 15 point swing. If that's true, it seems iron clad.

Rachel Bitecofer
Yeah. Biden's numbers are absolutely wretched. Right. But one thing that Cenk didn't touch on that I want to point out is that the fact is I've studied, as an empirical political scientist, presidential campaigns, you don't get a lot of them. It's a pretty small model. N 34, n 36, because so many of them serve two terms. But I've still studied it empirically. And the fact of the matter is, we've never had an ex former president run against an incumbent president.

So some of the things that you see with the Biden numbers are the difference in 2020 and 2024, basically, of incumbency being the in party versus the outlandish party. If we were the out party, I'd be in the Caribbean right now on vacation because it's summer. I wouldn't have to worry. We were definitely going to win. Everything would be great. Okay. The problem here is I want to talk one thing about what Jenks brought up here, that he's convinced Joe Biden's going to drop out and that, you know, da da da. And that, that their effort and effort of some of other people, especially the Beltway media, to kind of pound him, pound this narrative, especially this hidden health narrative, that's going to be the new birtherism.

That.

Cenk Uygur
Don't say that, Rachel. Don't say that.

Rachel Bitecofer
Hold on, let me finish my thought. Thank you. So, you know, with all of that stuff, like, we have to, we have to remember, if Joe Biden doesn't leave office, okay, if we don't get him to quit, if he doesn't disappear, if he doesn't decide, by the way, that he wants to leave, and then gift all of the campaign infrastructure, all of the campaign money, and all of the machine over to Harris, which is why, another reason it has to be Harris, then, you know, the people are going to pay is not Joe Biden. Joe Biden doesn't give two hoots if he wins or loses, obviously, right? I mean, he said, oh, as long as I gave it my old college try. That's because Joe Biden, like many of our elites, are going to get on airplanes and fly out of here if Donald Trump wins, ok, it's the rest of us that are going to be here. And so, Cenk, if you're wrong and you can't get him to leave, and he is your only horse and it is your only thing separating. Like, we're talking about mass, mass deportations of brown people, we're talking about loyalty oaths of Muslims. It's all on Trump's website laid right out there. In his own words, this is what we're going to do. Project 2025 is about how have the power to ignore the constitution to do it. These are facts. That's what's coming for our most marginalized community members, black community, trans community. So given those stakes, what I am personally, at least for me, what I can control is me. I am mission focused. If Joe Biden stops being the nominee, I will work to elect whoever the replacement is.

But if he is the nominee, I'm not going to try to dig a hole deeper and deeper and deeper by doing the Hillary Clinton pile up that we did in 2016. 2.0.

David Pakman
Ok, I want to hear from Cenk on that. On one, the Hillary Clinton pileup and to your reaction to what Rachel said about the medical Biden story.

Cenk Uygur
Yeah. So first of all, it, I jumped in there because don't, don't compare eight out of ten Americans who believe that there's something wrong with Joe Biden's.

Rachel Bitecofer
I'm not saying that. That's not true. I conceded that point right in the beginning of my first statement.

Cenk Uygur
What was the birtherism comment?

Rachel Bitecofer
But, but, but here's the thing. What you're talking about is how they'll weaponize it. That's all I care about, too. And where we liberals, I'm not saying you, but everybody, I, everybody else except for me, it feels like it's constantly, oh, Biden's got this. He's got that. We got this and we got that, and it's going to kill us. And I, all I look, when I look at the Republican Party right now, especially Donald Trump, is. I see weakness.

Weakness. Okay, Donald Trump. Yes. Joe Biden. America doesn't like Joe Biden, but you know who they really don't like is Donald Trump. So when you know Cenk, when you're pulling up those approval ratings, you got to pull up Donald Trump's right. I mean, it's the same thing because it's not the, in Trump's case, a little bit more is the man. It's the time period that we're living in. We're living in historic highs of tribalism.

David Pakman
All right, let's let Cenk react to that now that you've clarified, Rachel.

Cenk Uygur
Okay, so there is no birtherism. He is in mental decline. And eight out of ten Americans are not wrong. So now that we've established that.

So you're telling me about all the dangers of Donald Trump and all of his weaknesses.

Well, sister, I couldn't agree more. That's why I'm pulling all my hair out and why for the last year, as David knows, I've tried so hard to get a different candidate. Why are we voluntarily losing to this guy? How pathetic is democratic leadership that they told us all we're geniuses? Don't worry. Let us anoint. Let us pick. We picked Hillary Clinton. She's guaranteed to be Donald Trump.

Rachel Bitecofer
Well, no voters picked Hillary Clinton, dude. Okay? I wrote a book, an academic book on it. The voters picked Hillary Clinton.

Cenk Uygur
Yeah, yeah.

Rachel Bitecofer
Super delegates.

Cenk Uygur
So, all right, look, I've been through this debate 200 times, right? So mainstream media picked Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. And so they said that she was great. The anointed one. They counted the super delegates before they even voted. They made it seem like she had a huge lead. The DNC laundered money through the states to give it to Hillary Clinton. They scheduled the debates on football nights. Very little of them. If you don't think that the DNC wanted Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden to win in 2016 and 2020, you're kidding yourself. No one.

Rachel Bitecofer
I didn't say that. I'm just saying that at the end of the day, the voters.

Cenk Uygur
At the end of the day, after you rigged the entire process through all the media, and then they got rid of their.

Rachel Bitecofer
And Bernie still lost. Speaker zero.

Cenk Uygur
Yeah, okay. I don't want to get into the 2016 debate. Okay, let's.

No, no, no. Let me speak. Let me speak. Okay, so bottom line is, in 2016, you guys were wrong.

You were wrong. You said Hillary Clinton was a great candidate who was. No, hold on. I let you speak. The only way you could have any help here is to keep interrupting me. So in 2016, did Hillary Clinton beat Donald Trump? I said she wouldn't, and I said, please, let's pick a different candidate so we could beat this moron. But you also know.

David Pakman
Hold on. Let's let Cenk finish. Let's let Jen finish his thought.

Rachel Bitecofer
He did. I want to just remind people that he spent the whole cycle.

David Pakman
Speaker one. You'll be able to make that point, Rachel, but let's. Let's cenk lay it out.

Cenk Uygur
Speaker one. Every time we say, pick a stronger candidate, for God's sake, look at the polling. Bernie was up by twelve points against Trump. I'm not relitigating Bernie. If that's gone, that ship has sailed. And at this point, we're not going to pick a progressive. Those are Biden delegates. They're going to pick an establishment candidate. I'm not here to fight old fights. All I'm saying is democratic leadership has been wrong all the time. Please snap out of the hypnosis of believing these morons. They're very stupid, average people who are like, oh, who pays my checks? Hillary Clinton picked me at the DNC. I will support Hillary Clinton. Joe Biden picked me to run the DNC. I will support Joe Biden. They're self interested. You think they can't read a poll? You think they can't. They don't have eyes and ears. They didn't see that debate. They're sticking with them not because they want to beat Trump, but because of their own self interest. Joe Biden hired all those guys at the DNC. The entire campaign would be fired tomorrow if Joe Biden stepped down. And Jill Biden obviously is a massive egomaniac who thinks she's the president so that his inner circle is a disaster. He's the most selfish man I've ever met. He doesn't mind losing democracy on his watch. You think he. No one in his inner circle understands that you cannot make a 15 point comeback, that that's never been done in american history. And a guy who refuses to do interviews and can barely campaign is going to do the most miraculous comeback.

There's no chance of that. So anyone who's a arguing for Biden is arguing for Trump. They're saying, I don't mind if Trump wins. It's not that big a deal to me if Trump wins. When you see my question now, can.

Rachel Bitecofer
I ask you a question?

Cenk Uygur
Let me just finish this point. And I slowly got the comment.

Rachel Bitecofer
I mean, I've heard your establishment random.

David Pakman
You'll ask the question in a moment. Rachel. Cenk. Cenk's wrapping up his thought here.

Rachel Bitecofer
All right.

Cenk Uygur
Okay, guys, you only. If you stick with Biden, it is a guaranteed loss if you go to another path, whether it's Kamala Harris or another. Don't worry. Super establishment, very corporate Democrat. Okay. You haven't, you actually have a chance to beat Donald Trump if you pick someone other than Kamala Harris. All of a sudden we go from massive underdogs to favorites. We would be favorites. Would gain about ten points. Please don't throw away this election. Please don't put Trump back in charge. Rachel, the one thing you're right about is, look, I'm Muslim. You wanted to ban all Muslims from the country. I hate Trump. I don't know why you want to give the speaker.

David Pakman
All right, let's let Rachel respond to that. And also, Rachel, in your response and take it however you want. Address the ten point gain claim that Cenk makes as well.

Rachel Bitecofer
I'm happy to do that. It's. It's going to be a lift, guys. It's always going to be a lift. Here's one thing that Cenk has to confront all the polling with the replacement people. Same data, okay? It's the same data. I mean, I've seen poll after poll, Harris, Biden, whoever, Buttigieg, Whitmer, whatever it is, all compared to Biden's numbers, basically the same. Why? Why? Because it's not about the candidate. It's about the brand. Okay? We've got a bad brand, and voters are associating that brand with all of our candidates. Okay? So there's that again. If I could wave a magic wand and I could put, let's say, my dream ticket, Gretchen Whitmer and Josh Shapiro, into the nomination thing, I would be in the Caribbean right now. I'd be like, woo. Things are going to be great. I don't operate in wouldn't it be great land? I operate in reality land. Okay. And in reality land. To do that, you have to isolate Joe Biden voters. If you skip Kamala two, you're isolating both the Biden and Kamala base. Good luck organizing and winning because those are the core organizational like gas of the party. Okay, I want to wrap around why you've been doing media. No offense. I've been working on campaigns and elections. I actually destroyed my whole career to go do that and took a massive pay cut, do a lot of my work pro bono in 2022. This leadership that he just eviscerated as do nothing terrible leadership, modified enough of the strategy electorally that we were able to go in and blunt their red wave.

It wasn't a miracle. Okay? It didn't just happen. It happened because of work. Like Jamie from Jamie, Harrison from me, from others who are working on the strategy. So it's very easy from the sidelines to be like, don't you just want Trump to win? I have a disabled son, okay? I'm gonna have to flee over the border on foot because I don't have the context of a young Turk show. Okay?

I have highly incentivized to win the election.

The question is, can you take a nominee in July? July 10 is today, whip him out, even though you already have the operation going in these fields, in these swing states, and switch him and be in a better position to win? And the answer to that is, I don't know. Ok? I know any one of the replacements that are discussed. But again, Kamala is the only feasible replacement would, would eviscerate Donald Trump on the stump. I know that, okay? But they each bring with them their own set of negatives. And perhaps the most important negative is how media behaves. Media is very predictable. That's why I cover it in my book so extensively. If we put a new candidate in the DC Beltway isn't going to just magically stop. They're going to start hounding that new nominee about whatever it is, their weaknesses. Okay?

The conversation is going to increasingly revolve around us.

And, you know, as I say in the book, voters are just not that into us, okay? Especially the progress. Like the super progressive base, like when we took the bell curve of humanity. Our policies, progressive policies are super popular. Climate change, guns, whatever, right? But not things like Gaza, okay? Not things like, you know, loan forgiveness or what have you, right? We are very, very lucky if we can keep the conversation around what project 2025 means for average Americans because it's going to affect every single family in this country. I just randomly pointed at a page yesterday, looked it up. What is it? Eviscerates free school lunch for poor kids.

So this allegation that somehow everyone's sitting in an office in DC not caring what's going to happen with the election, I just want to really push back at that. It's very easy on the sidelines to, like, call in. Trust me, I'm still largely on the sidelines calling in. Right. Like, do this, do that. It is very easy to make those judgments. But I want to be careful about, you know, it is not going to help us if we spend the next four months ranting about how corrupt the Democratic Party is. The Democratic National Committee is every day that you have an audience and you're not using it to freak them out about what's coming for Muslims and immigrants in this country and trans people, then you're doing the country a disservice.

David Pakman
If you value what we do at the David Pakman show, remember, to support us on Patreon, go to patreon.com David Pakman show, where you can get access to behind the scenes videos, the daily bonus show, the commercial free daily show. You can support the show for as little as $2 a month. Check it out@patreon.com. david Pakman show now. Well, let Cenk address that. And in your world, Cenk, when is Biden replaced and with whom?

Cenk Uygur
Speaker one. Yeah. So there is one thing that Rachel and I agree on. Whitmer Shapiro would be a terrific ticket. Would beat Donald Trump.

We're choosing not to beat Donald Trump. We agree on what would be the great ticket. We agree that that ticket would win. We basically agree that Biden has almost no chance of winning. So what are we doing here? This is totally mad.

Rachel Bitecofer
Well, can I just. I'm not going to cut you off, but, like, just so you know, we do agree on that. But the problem is, is like, I'm factoring as a political scientist, knowing how these conventions and nominations and infrastructure operates. I've studied it. I've taught it. I know how much infrastructure goes into the act of turning out the vote and sank. Now, we know what happens when you, when you don't do it right. In 2018, 2020, when they suspended all the field operations for Democrats and we got hammered down ballot. That's why no organization. So that organization comes, like, if we get rid of them, it would be one thing if we could wipe it and everyone would be happy. But you're going to have people pissed off. So how. Yes, Shapiro and Whitmer are great, great ticket. Until you factor in how they got there. If they get there by pissing off Biden and Kamala voters, you're going to have big problems.

David Pakman
All right, Cenk, address that specifically.

Cenk Uygur
Okay. Address here. Here we go. So, number one, you guys make it seem like there's only downsides to the new people. Oh, my God. How will they ever get an organization set up with the same exact organization you have now? The DNC. It's not like the DNC disappears overnight. It's not like those offices disappear overnight. You just put in a new candidate and you say, well, that's a little bit of risk. Okay, fine. Oh, they have been vetted yet. Enough. Okay. By the way, that's why you shouldn't just be anointing Kamala Harris. She hasn't been vetted enough. We should actually vet all of our candidates at the convention and pre convention. Okay, but you say, well, then Gretchen Whitmer, maybe she's got something. We don't know. Maybe it's a little bit of risk. So that's easy to say. And it's true. Those are a little bit of risk, except you have to compare it to the alternative, which is maximum risk. If you keep Biden in, we all know that he's got an, I mean, what is it, a 90, 95, 99% chance of losing? Doesn't get any riskier than that.

From a loss to a loss. But.

David Pakman
So that's a mathematic. So cenk, you say 99% Biden loses Rachel says it's 50 50.

Rachel Bitecofer
That's what the 538 model says.

I mean, here's the thing.

Cenk Uygur
What, you want to bet on it?

Rachel Bitecofer
Here's the thing is that. Oh, I mean. I mean, if I had a bet against you in the past, I got to warn you, I would have cleaned up, so.

Cenk Uygur
Oh, really? Because I've almost never been wrong, so go ahead. Here. Let's do it now. Sure.

The don't know.

Rachel Bitecofer
Quit. You want to bet on that? Because he's not going to quit, dude.

Cenk Uygur
And easy one for you, Rachel. It's a layup if Joe Biden stays in the race. Thousand dollars. I see.

Rachel Bitecofer
I don't have that kind of money. I'm.

Cenk Uygur
No, no. And I'll give you. I'll give you a huge advantage. I'll give you a huge advantage. I say he loses every single swing state. Come on.

Rachel Bitecofer
Okay. I mean, it's hard to bet something like that, but I'd rather do it for, like, you know, $100 something I can.

Cenk Uygur
Sure, $100, $10, it doesn't matter.

Rachel Bitecofer
The people there, you know, I don't.

Cenk Uygur
No problem. I just wanted to be real enough stakes that it hurts both of us if we lose, so that.

Rachel Bitecofer
Oh, no, here's the thing. Like, I mean, if we lose the race, I mean, this is why I quit my academic job. I had a. I could have gone into think tank world. They wanted to pay me a ludicrous amount of money to come sit in DC. Okay. And instead, I'm like, no, no, no. I got to fix how Democrats election year, because we're going to lose in 2022. And we didn't. We held all the blue wall states. We should have lost them all. We held them all. Why? Because of good strategy. Right?

David Pakman
And so why. Why was it then? Why was it Cenk?

Rachel Bitecofer
Here's my counterpeople.

Cenk Uygur
No, hold on. I didn't. I barely got to say anything.

David Pakman
Yeah, yeah. Let Cenk. Later.

Cenk Uygur
Let me address the 80 other things that were brought up. So, number one, the reason we won in 2022 is because the Republicans are super unpopular and they took women's right to choose away.

David Pakman
So.

Cenk Uygur
But that's not a Joe Biden thing. That's a. Any debt Democrat would do better than the Republicans. In fact, all we're saying is, Jesus, just get to neutral. Just don't have a candidate. That's a disaster. And you'll very likely win as you did in 2022. It's not the strength of the democratic brand. As you acknowledge yourself, the democratic brand is bad, but then, Rachel, you don't take the next logical step. How did it get bad? It got bad because the DNC sucks.

Rachel Bitecofer
No, it's bad. Yes, it is bad because the DNC sucks. You're right. Okay, there. That is why I committed my career to.

David Pakman
All right, so we agree on that point.

Rachel Bitecofer
Yeah. Yeah.

Cenk Uygur
Okay, so it is also bad because.

Rachel Bitecofer
We don't answer their propaganda. We. They are talking about us.

David Pakman
Hold on, Rachel, though. Hold on, hold on. I'm monitoring time, and I want to make sure Cenk gets his time to fully lay this out, address the DNC issue.

Cenk Uygur
Okay, so every time that we say, hey, can you please fix this? Like, for example, paid family leave pulls at 84% and a huge percentage, about over 90% of Democrat democratic voters. And amazingly, even 74% of republican voters want paid family leave. So, Joe Biden, can you please introduce paid family leave? It's a layup. And then you can go down the list. Marijuana legalizations at over 70%, raising the minimum wages over two thirds, on and on and on. And Biden just sits. There goes, nope, I'm not going to do it because my donors don't want it. And then, and then when we say, hey, please, why don't you want to win? Then people like you turn around and say, oh, you're hurting us. Let us just keep syncing the brand with super unpopular policies for no goddamn reason. When the democratic voters actually have incredibly popular policies, why don't you fight for them? Why don't you get them passed? If you got two or three of the easiest layups in the world, past or even at this late, they just proposed it, it would improve your brand. If you had a better candidate, it would improve your brand. But every time we suggest improving the brand, they go, you're being disloyal. You're a heretic. You're helping Trump, you're helping the Republicans. We should stay unpopular and have the worst candidate. How does that help Democrats? So every time you go to help, every time you go to fix, we get blamed? Well, okay, if you're not going to listen to anything we say, then, okay, you're going to own the loss.

You own 2016. You picked a terrible candidate. We told you, and we were totally right. And I told you a year ago, you talk about the sidelines? You kidding me? I entered the race and I knew that it was desperation. And I told David on this show, I said, of course, the chance of winning is microscopic, but I'm so desperate to get a different candidate if I just do a little bit better, or Dean Phillips just does a little bit better. Maybe we can get the popular democratic governors into the race and actually win this thing. I've risked my entire career to try to make sure that we have a better candidate against Trump, and all I've gotten from the establishment guys is grief. Why are you trying to help? I think you're helping Trump by having us pick a better candidate. No, we should pick the worst candidate there is that eight out of ten americans think his brain's not even working, and we should just go to the like lambs to the slaughter. If that is a brilliant idea of democratic leadership. Of course our brand sucks because our leaders suck. I need you to stop listening to them. It's like a form of hypnosis. Please trust yourselves. If you're a voter and if your gut is screaming Biden, then okay, go Biden. Go Harris, whatever you need. But just make the decision yourself instead of loaning out your brain to the morons at the DNC and the morons at morning Joe, who are always wrong. Just look at our track records. They're always wrong. So last thing is, there are no Biden voters that you're going to alienate.

There's Blue Maga who's like, oh, I will do whoever the leader is. But it doesn't matter because the minute you give them a new leader, Blue Maga will just turn to that new leader and go, we are now for the new leader. We are for the new leader. There's no Biden voters. The only Biden voter in the country is Jill Biden. And then we still haven't gotten to Kamala Harris. That's a longer topic. She would be better than Biden. But don't anoint. Stop anointing. Let the strongest Democrat win. What is wrong with the simplest concept in the world? Let the strongest Democrat beat Donald Trump.

Let's pick the strongest. Why is this so hard?

David Pakman
All right, Rachel, as we, this is your next comment will have to be the last one on this as we're getting to the end of our time.

Talk about what you see in the next week and in the next few months. And maybe the one thing I'll go back to Cenk on and I want you to address as well, Rachel, is there are some who say the debate quite literally will make no difference. It, it's too far out from the election. It doesn't change the structure of the debate, doesn't change the economy. It doesn't change whether there's incumbency advantage. It doesn't change the fundamentals. How much does the debate matter? I'd love for you to weigh in on. And then we'll go back to Cenk to wrap speaker one.

Rachel Bitecofer
Yeah, look, I mean, we, in our coverage, we hear it all the time, like, oh, the election's winding down, or we're coming into the final stretch. Right? And I always point out to people, no, for everybody else, it hasn't started yet, and you can't make it start earlier. Right? So the question was, can we? Because we had this unprecedented situation where Trump won't do the real debates, right? So we end up with this debate in June. And I, you know, as a political scientist and forecast is what I do, right. I thought, I'm betting we're going to see significant ratings declines because it's in June, it's not after Labor Day. And that's exactly what we saw. We saw a huge interest drop. Some of that is also powered by the fact that nobody wants Donald Trump. I mean, we talk about how nobody wants Joe Biden, but the truth is nobody wants either of these men. Right? It's a nobody wants election, just like in 2016. And that's why that third party vote defection factor could be so determinative in the results. Okay, nobody likes either one of these people in terms of, like, regular swing voter, normal Americans. Okay? So it's the everybody sucks election 2.0. Right?

David Pakman
All right, Cenk. So feel free to address polling. And also, at the end of the day, will the debate have staying power to make a difference here?

Cenk Uygur
Yeah. So first I explain on our, on the young Turks all the time that the reason you're seeing these wild swings from left to right all over the world, in Brazil, in France, UK, anywhere here in America, and people can't make sense of it. Do people want left wing or do they want right wing? Why do they keep changing their minds so dramatically? Like in the UK, giant win for labor or historic win after Brexit. Isn't that weird? Right? And then in France, you had this huge. The right was supposed to win and then the left won. And so there's actually an easy explanation. It isn't. Oh, the polling is wrong or whatever. No, it's that whatever is changed wins.

So the party in France that won was formed a month ago, and they came out of nowhere and won the entire election. And the reason is people are saying, we hate corporate rule, we hate the current system. We loathe it. So if you give me change, I'm going to vote for change.

So that pattern is so well established, all across the world over the last decade. Now what are we, yeah. And so now what are we doing as Democrats?

We're saying we're the no change party.

We're going to stick with the establishment candidate who's 81 years old and can't finish a sentence instead of going for change.

If we stick with Biden, we're the non change people. They're going to vote for change on top of every other poll, on top of every historic number there is. It's among the reasons why Biden has no chance. On the other hand, Rachel's right about these big swings because of the abortion issue. Let's take the win.

Give me Gretchen Whitmer, give me Josh Shapiro, give me Andy Bashir. Give me any generic Democrat, and for God's sake, take the win.

Why are we giving away this election?

Historians will look back and we'll be befuddled. They'll say, why did they choose to lose? It was the most amazing thing anybody's ever seen. They had a historically terrible candidate and they had perfectly fine candidates they could have gone with. But no, they chose to run straight into the iceberg. So when it comes to the debate, David, people talk about debates like, oh, they're all the same. After Obama got crushed by Romney in the first debate, you know what I said? I said, guys, this doesn't mean a damn thing. Obama's a lock to win. And I was right about that. Why? Because they're two normal candidates. Obama had an off night. Obama's incredibly smart. He's going to come back and he's going to do well in the other debates. And his records good. And he's a great campaigner. He had terrific hard hitting ads out. So, you know, whether I agree or disagree with all of Obama's policies, he was a terrific candidate. So when you're just talking about winning. Right. But now you fast forward to this debate. This debate isn't about just one debate. This debate showed Joe Biden's actual mental health may look mainstream. Mediataindehenhezenhe and morning Joe is the epicenter of it. They set up this play for you. It's like you go into the theater and they do this play and they keep Joe Biden hidden. He barely does any events. He didn't even do the Super bowl interview. That's the biggest softball. That's tens of millions of people and some of them that don't normally vote. Every president does the Super bowl interview.

You're giving away tens, maybe hundreds of millions of dollars in free media. So they kept him hidden. They kept a mad king hidden. And every time he came out, they pretended that the emperor had clothes on. So at the debate, what happened, David, was the american people saw with their own eyes, the emperor has no clothes.

He was exposed. So this thing is over. They're not going to change their mind. Joe Biden is not going to spring back to life and start doing where's his press conferences? If I was accused of having mental or cognitive health issues, I would have done a four hour press conference. I would have done twelve of the toughest interviews you've ever seen and I would have crushed them. Any good candidate would. Joe Biden still hasn't done any of those things because he's capable of it.

Rachel Bitecofer
Can I clarify?

David Pakman
Well, listen, guys, Rachel clarified, but we're.

Rachel Bitecofer
Way over time in twelve days and Biden's been out the whole time, multiple events every day.

David Pakman
That's true. That's true. And we've covered that.

Rachel Bitecofer
People know Biden is out very aggressively. Just nothing doing the thing that speaker.

David Pakman
One, he's not doing the things Cenk is pointing out though. That's fair. Listen, guys, we must end.

We could go on another 45 minutes. We've been speaking with Rachel Bitta coffer and Cenk Uygur. I so appreciate you guys taking time to talk to me today and to talk to each other. Thanks so much.

Rachel Bitecofer
Yep. Thanks for having me and thanks for, for fighting with me, Jake.

You can lock that hundred bucks in, though. I couldn't afford that.

David Pakman
Follow us on social media. Interact with the David Pakman show community. See exclusive content, see when we're taking calls live, and stay up to date on other big show announcements. We post daily. Find us on Reddit, Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, discord and TikTok.

All right. Failed former President Donald Trump, now a convicted felon and civilly liable rapist, has exited hiding. Remember that Trump has been missing. He has an event at his own house this week, week, but otherwise has been essentially missing since the debate, maybe by design in the sense that he's trying to let the corporate media do his bidding. He emerged from hiding sort of to call into the Sean Hannity propaganda program on Fox News. Hannity tried to get him, first of all, softball interview. Trump still makes himself look like a fool. Hannity trying to get Trump to announce his running mate on his show. Trump says his plan is soon, but not quite yet.

Sean Hannity
Let me ask you one last question if I may. And I know this was last minute. Thanks for, thanks for calling in tonight.

And I want to ask you about your vp choice.

How soon do you think you'll be making that choice, number one? Number two, we keep reading that there is a short list. And on the short list we hear names like Senator Rubio, Senator Tim Scott, Senator JD Vance, Governor Bergam.

Is that, are those reports accurate? Are there other people maybe people aren't paying attention to? And when do you think you'll announce that?

Donald Trump
Well, you know, we started off with a lot of people. We have a lot of good people, as they call it. We have a great bench in the Republican Party. The names that you mentioned, absolutely. They're under consideration. And I haven't made final decision, but I have some ideas as to where we're going. And a little bit, you know, we wanted to see what they're doing to be honest, because, you know, it might make a difference. I don't know. I'm not sure that it would. But there are those that say Trump's waiting until he finds out what's going to happen with crooked Joe Biden. And we'll see what happens with Biden. But, you know, I think probably within the next week, week and a half, probably some time, I'd love to do it during the convention. My people say that's a little complicated. You know, in the old days, they would announce the vice president during the convention. Today, with modern day technology, you can't do things that you could have done 50 years ago very easily, but probably a little before the convention, but not much. It could even be during the convention that we're doing. I'd love to do it during the convention. I think it would be a very interesting build up and important for the convention, would make it even more exciting in Milwaukee.

Sean Hannity
If you announced it right now on this show, I think it'd make a lot of news. I'm just saying.

Donald Trump
Well, if I did it, I'd love to do it with you.

David Pakman
All right, so Hannity wants the announcement. Remember that Trump, now we know, has lied many times about this because six, nine months ago during a town hall on Fox News, he said, I've already selected the person. They don't know. I haven't announced it, but I've already selected the person. Then Trump went back. I haven't selected. It's been narrowed down. The field has been expanded. I don't know if Trump even knows what's going on with his VP pick joining, by the way, joining Sean Hannity. In his dire predictions, Trump says, we are going to have a terrorist attack on american soil.

And they seem eager. I hate to say it, but they seem eager. Speaker one.

Donald Trump
Well, the one thing you haven't said tonight that you always say is that it's 100% certain that we're going to have a terror attack. And I agree with you on that. It's 100% certain.

Sean Hannity
I mean, we're letting, I pray I'm wrong.

Donald Trump
I prefer letting terrorists into our country at a level that we've never seen before.

David Pakman
How can you be 100% sure that there is going to be a terrorist attack unless you're involved? Right? I mean, and I'm not alleging that Hannity or Trump are involved, but they insist with this thing. How can you be so sure about something like that, a predictive claim like that, unless you know something we don't? And that would be a very scary scenario. Of course, at another moment, Trump just seeming unhinged, ranting about World War three and how the military does things for.

Donald Trump
Him, semi running things, because he's not running things. The people that surround the Oval Office, the people that surround the resolute desk, the beautiful resolute desk, they're really running things in Washington, I suspect. And it's very bad. And, you know, he got them into the warfare and lawfare, many different terms you can use, but basically going after your political opponent, using the Justice Department, using local Das, using local attorney generals, going after your political opponent, nobody's ever seen anything like that. And, you know, there are those, I just read an article that it was a, it's been a positive for me, but it's not a positive. It's very unfair. It's fighting an unfair battle. But he's the one that got us into that. And all these lawsuits, you see, and everything else, that's all Biden inspired, meaning Biden people inspired.

David Pakman
Speaker one, remember, there's no evidence of that at all.

Donald Trump
And it's a, you know, very sad, I think it's a very sad time for our country. We're not respected anywhere in the world. He's not respected, and our country is in very serious trouble. And I'll tell you what, if we're not careful, we're going to be right in the middle of world war three, and that will be a war like nobody's seen before because of the weaponry. The weaponry is a whole lot different than two army tanks going up against each other. This is a whole different world.

David Pakman
Lot of predictions, 100% chance of a terrorist attack here on us soil, were absolutely going to be in world war three. This is ugly stuff. This is supposed to be an easy interview. And he shows he simply can't keep it together or handle any topic substantively. And then Trump, if you want any sign of how poor the moderation was during the presidential debate, it's Trump saying the moderation was good, weak.

Donald Trump
I didn't know exactly what was happening. It was strange. I do have to say that the CNN, Jake and Dana, they were really, they were pretty good. They were. They really, they were. I thought they were fair. I thought they were fair in the questions. I thought to him, to me.

David Pakman
But, and part of the reason, of course, that Trump perceived the moderation as fair is that it was negotiated that the moderators would not interject with fact checking and there would be no visual fact checking on the screen. And to Trump, that's a really great thing because he got away with at 1.6 lies in something like 85 seconds. So Trump coming out of hiding to do a softball interview with Hannity and reminding us, you know, I'm going to do an op ed maybe tomorrow, maybe, maybe Thursday. What day is it? I don't even know. What week is it? I'm going to make a commentary this week that for all the discussion about Biden, Trump should have already dropped out. And one of the things we shouldn't forget is that whatever your opinion is of President Biden's debate performance a week and a half ago, and my opinion is it wasn't good.

Trump's debate performance was atrocious and is uniquely disqualifying to him as being president of the United States. So that's Trump. Let's now go briefly to Don Junior. Donald Trump junior claimed on his Rumble show triggered, I know he claimed on his Rumble show triggered that he has heard that Biden will be resigning Friday.

My question is, is it likely that Don Junior is the guy who would know this? But let's listen to what he says first.

Cenk Uygur
This week, Biden says he's not going anywhere. Now, I don't know if I believe that. I've heard from a couple people that are insiders, let's call it the big money lobbyist types, that, that, you know.

Donald Trump
He'S going to, he's going to resign.

Cenk Uygur
On, you know, or he's out on Friday.

Rachel Bitecofer
I don't know if that's accurate or not.

Cenk Uygur
We'll find out soon enough. So we, we'll see.

David Pakman
But he has sources that Biden's getting out Friday. Now, you know, the other funny thing about this is that there are, so Bill O'Reilly made a claim about this, all sorts of different people. One little aspect to this I want to mention.

There are folks with these predictions interchangeably talking about Biden's dropping out of the presidential re election campaign versus Biden is resigning the presidency of the United States.

I would love it for some of these folks to actually be questioned. Of course, they're rarely in a, in a scenario where you can question them, but I would love to, for them to be asked. Wait, just so I understand, are you saying Biden is removing himself as a candidate for reelection, or are you saying Biden is resigning the presidency? Because they're talking about these things interchangeably and they are very different things. Now, important to mention.

Important to mention. There are those, and this came up during our panel today, who believe that if Biden doesn't announce I'm not running for reelection before the convention, it will be too late. And if and when Biden ultimately does drop out, he will have to resign. Why he would have to resign, I don't really know, but that's another hypothesis that's floating around. So does Don Junior know something we don't know, or is this another one of his made up ramblings, hopped up if I've ever seen it. You be the judge. We have a great bonus show for you today. We will talk about the search for Trump's vp. We will talk about the mysterious disappearance of South Dakota governor Christy nomes. Official social media accounts. Where did they go? Why is her twitter gone? What's going on? And we will also discuss the first republican platform since 2016. It's been released. It's a doozy. It's filled with a lot of what you might expect. Get access to the bonus show by becoming a member at join pacman.com and get that free project 2025 white paper now 30,000 downloads. It's nuts.

Crazy.

Excuse me, I'm getting all choked up because of the white paper. You can get the white paper for free at david pakman.com slash project 2025.

7/9/24: Biden says he's staying in, Parkinson's conspiracy explodes, Trump softball interview

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1: Biden's Re-election Campaign

2: Parkinson's Conspiracy

3: Trump's Media Strategy

4: Political Panel Discussion

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