Ukraine…Invades Russia?

This episode discusses a surprising military move by Ukraine involving a significant incursion into Russian territory, marking a dramatic shift in the ongoing conflict.

1. Ukraine's military action is aimed at humiliating Russia by capturing soldiers and attacking military assets on Russian soil.
2. The incursion is not intended for territorial gain but as a strategic maneuver to strengthen Ukraine's position in future negotiations.
3. Ukrainian forces deployed tanks and special forces deep into Russian territory, indicating the scale and seriousness of the operation.
4. The action has caused a stir within pro-Kremlin circles and could potentially shift the military focus and resources within Russia.
5. The episode also touches on the broader political implications, especially with the upcoming U.S. presidential election and potential shifts in policy towards Ukraine.

1: The Incursion

Details the unexpected military move by Ukraine into Russian territory, highlighting the strategic and tactical elements of the operation. James Longman: "This is the biggest thing, basically the most dramatic move that I've seen Ukraine make."

2: Reactions and Implications

Explores the immediate reactions within Russia and the potential long-term implications for the war and international relations. James Longman: "It's humiliating for Russia in the first instance."

3: Political Context

Discusses the global and domestic political ramifications of the incursion, especially in light of the upcoming U.S. elections. Donald Trump: "I will have that settled prior to taking the White House as president elect."

1. Stay informed on global conflicts to understand their implications on international stability and security.
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3. Engage in community discussions or forums to raise awareness and understanding of international conflicts.
4. Consider the impact of foreign policies when voting in national elections to influence international diplomacy and peace efforts.
5. Advocate for peaceful resolutions and diplomatic engagements to prevent escalations in conflict zones.

Ukraine launches a surprise incursion of a Russian city. Sen. JD Vance questions Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz’s military service, in what some are calling a “Swift Boat”-like attack. And American sprinter Noah Lyles misses out on a historic double gold after competing with COVID.

People

Volodymyr Zelenskyy, Donald Trump

Companies

None

Books

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Guest Name(s):

James Longman

Content Warnings:

None

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Brad Milke
It's Friday, August 9, and they want to do the invading for once. We start here.

Launches a surprise incursion into russian territory.

James Longman
This is the biggest thing, basically the most dramatic move that I've seen Ukraine make.

Brad Milke
These scenes are reverberating throughout the region. But what does it mean for the wider war? If you thought Swift boating was a political tactic of the past, welcome to 2024.

JD Vance
What bothers me about Tim Walts is.

Brad Milke
The stolen valor garbage, the attacks on Tim Waltz, and the context. You need to separate fact from fiction. And he lost the gold while battling Covid. And he's not the only one.

Unknown
We treat Covid no differently to any other respite, but treat illness. But we want to ensure that we have our protocols working as well.

Brad Milke
With cases spreading, these Olympics have become a contest of who can stay healthy.

From ABC News, this is start here. I'm Brad Milke.

In recent months, it's been dawning on anyone watching the war in Ukraine that the Russians are making unmistakable gains along the front. The manpower of Ukraine is diminished. The aid from the US, some said, came too late. And yet this week, something strange has happened.

We started hearing about a new incursion, not into Ukraine, but into Russia. That's right. These were ukrainian troops marching across the border. And now it appears this was even more significant than initially understood. ABC's foreign correspondent James Longman is with us. James, we've seen Ukraine try to hit Russia's homeland before, but it's usually come in the form of like, some shelling here or some drone attacks there. What is happening there right now?

James Longman
This is extraordinary, Brad. I mean, I've reported a number of times you and I have spoken when we've heard about ukrainian, sort of pro ukrainian militia crossing the border, trying to occupy villages, spoken about ukrainian missiles hitting targets inside Russia. This is completely different. The Ukrainians are taking responsibility for this. They say that this is a full scale military operation inside Russia. And it's extraordinary. We're hearing that there are ukrainian tanks on the ground, ukrainian special forces inside Russia, some more than 20 miles across the border. So this is an incredibly significant incursion. And we've seen videos that Ukrainians have put out of them taking russian soldiers prisoner. We've seen one extraordinary video of an attack drone, a ukrainian attack drone, taking out a russian helicopter mid flight. So this is. This is the biggest thing, basically the most dramatic move that I've seen Ukraine make in more than two years of war. And we don't know when this is going to end because it's been now three days or more of this attack. And we're not sure what Ukraine's plans are here, but it certainly made an impact.

Brad Milke
I was wondering why, James, because Ukraine, it's not like Ukraine is looking to take russian territory out of this. Is this to make Russia back off or what's the strategy here?

James Longman
Well, I think fundamentally, the first thing, which is always Ukraine's aim, is to try to humiliate Russia. To have these images of, of their soldiers being taken prisoner on their own territory is an effort to humiliate Russia, not just in the eyes of the world, but in the eyes of Russians as well. This is something that Russians are not used to seeing.

Pro Kremlin blogs have been alive with this all over the Internet. This is not something that Russians normally ever see. So it's humiliating for Russia in the first instance. But I think more than that strategic goal here is basically that Ukraine knows it's going to have to negotiate a way out of this war at some point. They see the US election looming. They see possibly Donald Trump becoming president.

Donald Trump
I think Zelensky is maybe the greatest salesman of any politician that's ever lived.

James Longman
He has made no secret of the fact that he wants to pull funding from Ukraine, that he thinks there should be a deal as soon as possible.

Donald Trump
I will have that settled prior to taking the White House as president elect. I will have that.

James Longman
So the Ukrainians are realists. They know that there's going to have to be a deal of some kind. When I was last there, I had for the first time, senior members of the military saying to me that there's going to have to be a deal. The question is what kind of deal? And Ukraine wants to go to any negotiation from a position of strength. So this is them putting their flag in the ground, if you like to say. If there's going to be talks, they're going to be on our terms. We want to negotiate from a position of strength. You're dealing with a serious party here in Ukraine, and we can make life difficult for the Russians.

Brad Milke
You talked about how Ukraine sees this as almost a chance to humiliate Russia. How is this affecting russian forces? I guess, is it having an impact?

James Longman
Well, that's really difficult to know. I mean, it doesn't seem to have impacted the war in Ukraine itself. I think it's fair to say that the battle lines have basically been frozen for some months now. Whether or not Russia is going to have to redeploy troops back into the homeland to try to defend this area of Kursk, we're not sure. One of the big impacts here might be on infrastructure, energy infrastructure, because one of the villages and one of the towns that has been attacked by the Ukrainians, is it critical for gas infrastructure in Russia? So there could be an impact there. But I don't think there's going to be a long term occupation of this area of Russia. This is something that the Ukrainians have done to grab the world's attention. And Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy hasn't spoken about it directly, but he's hinted at it in the way that he often does. He said that our ukrainian armed forces know how to surprise. So that's a not very veiled reference to what the Ukrainians have been up to.

Brad Milke
Something that you could imagine being seen as heroic or also desperate. And perhaps both of those things are kind of happening right now in Ukraine. All right, James Longman reporting. Thank you so much.

James Longman
Thanks a lot, Brad.

Brad Milke
Next up on start here. 24 years of National Guard service is usually a good thing on the campaign trail. So why is JD Vance attacking his fellow VP candidate? We're back in a bit.

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So, Michigan, I ask you, are you ready to make your voices heard?

In the days since Vice President Kamala Harris took over as the presumptive democratic nominee, the news for her has just kept getting better. An NPR poll this week showed Harris three points ahead among registered voters. Yesterday, another national poll from IPSO showed her up by five. It looks almost dead even in swing states. But for Democrats, this is a breath of fresh, and there's a time honored tradition among candidates. When you feel like you're winning, you keep your mouth shut. When you feel like you're losing, you gotta move the needle.

Donald Trump
Somehow I haven't recalibrated strategy at all. It's the same policies.

Brad Milke
Well, yesterday at Mar a Lago, former President Donald Trump gave his first open news conference in months.

Donald Trump
I think that abortion has become much less of an issue. It's a very small, I think it's actually going to be a very small issue.

Brad Milke
He's been criticizing vice President Harris for not answering questions from reporters, but he's also largely limited himself to friendly interviews and stump speeches. Well, here he promised finally to uphold his commitment to a debate on ABC News in September. And while he made some jabs toward.

Donald Trump
Harris Kamala, who, by the way, is worse than Biden, and she's actually not.

Brad Milke
As smart, it still seems like his campaign is unsure of which attacks they think will actually change the landscape. However, when it comes to the race for vice president, we are seeing what is in some ways a familiar tactic.

Donald Trump
Well, if he wants to have a debate about our service in Vietnam, here is my answer. Bring it on.

Brad Milke
20 years ago 2004, Democrats selected a nominee named John Kerry, who's a senator from Massachusetts, a foreign policy expert, and a decorated war hero. Well, then advertisements started coming out questioning his war record.

John Kerry
John Kerry has not been honest about what happened in Vietnam.

JD Vance
He is lying about his record.

Brad Milke
These ads featured Vietnam veterans who, like Kerry, had served in swift boats, but they claimed Kerry had exaggerated his tales of heroism that led to combat medals. They were contradicted in a report from the Navy inspector general, though, and men who had served alongside Kerry said these attacks were unfair hatchet jobs. They were effective, though. Kerry lost the election. And we got a new political swift boating.

Unknown
To his fellow veterans.

Brad Milke
He is sergeant major walls.

Well, this week, as Democrats have coalesced around Minnesota governor Tim Walls, the VP pick who served as a congressman, a high school football coach, a teacher, and a national guardsman, Donald Trump and JD Vance have latched onto that last biographical detail. Let's bring in ABC's Anne Flaherty, who covers the Pentagon for us. And Senator Vance has been tossing around this phrase, stolen valor, the way we usually refer to people who, like, wear veterans uniforms, who aren't veterans. What is going on here?

Anne Flaherty
So, you know, they really have three allegations against Tim Walls. And Tim Walls, just to back up here. He spent 24 years in the Army National Guard.

He was able to retire whenever he wanted. Once you've served that many years, you are able to step aside. And there was really no question about that. But the primary accusation by Vance is that Walz abandoned his unit right as they were about to deploy to Iraq.

JD Vance
You abandoned your unit right before they went to Iraq. And he has not spent a day in a combat zone. What bothers me about Tim Walts is the stolen valor garbage. Do not pretend to be something that you're not.

Anne Flaherty
And this was back in 2005. And what we found out what had happened was that Walz was planning to run for house office. He was planning to go into politics. He had been in the army National Guard for 23, 24 years, and he was torn because he wanted to stay with his unit. But he knew that in order to run for office he had to file for a deferment and then he would potentially have to come back if they did deploy. So we spoke with people who were colleagues with him at the time. They said that he felt that he had a window of time to decide does he stay in the army National Guard and stay with his unit or does he go into politics? And he said, I'm going to make the decision to stay and to try to serve in Congress.

Tim Walz
When I coached football, these stands held about 3000 people. That's a lot. It's also the number of american soldiers who have died fighting in Iraq.

Anne Flaherty
Now Walls was an anti war Democrat. He was very open and vocal about opposing the Bush administration's policies in the war.

Tim Walz
This president in this Congress shifted the focus from the true war on terror and put it to Iraq.

Anne Flaherty
At the time that he was making this decision, his unit, there had been heavy speculation that it would probably deploy to Iraq, but it wasn't a guarantee. He filed for retirement in May of 2005. And then two months later they got an alert order that said, yes, you were going to Iraq. So, you know, JD Vance seized on this. Of course, JD Vance being a military veteran who had gone to Iraq, I.

JD Vance
Think it's shameful to prepare your unit to go to Iraq, to make a promise that you're going to follow through and then to drop out right before you actually have to go.

Anne Flaherty
Well, when you look at Wells record, it wasn't that cut and dry. It was clear that he had a decision to make, that he could have gone to Iraq with his unit, but that there were other issues for him and that he was already in this house race and he wanted to commit to that.

Brad Milke
I see. But the idea of like stolen Valor, I usually think of somebody who like says, yeah, I served in Nom when actually they weren't like, they didn't do anything of the sort. Right. That's not, it's different from somebody being like, well, I only served 23 years in the National Guard instead of 24. Right? Like does JD Vance truly think that Walls is lying about his record?

Anne Flaherty
So there are a couple other issues. One is that Walz tells an audience in a clip that was tweeted out by the Harris campaign on Tuesday that he carried guns, quote, in war.

Tim Walz
And we can make sure that those weapons of war that I carried in war is the only place where those weapons are out.

Anne Flaherty
That's an interesting phrase to use because he never carried a gun in active combat. He would have carried a gun during his service when the US was at war following the 911 attacks. He was deployed to Italy, for example, in 2003 in support of Operation Enduring Freedom.

But there was no evidence that Walz was ever actually engaged in active combat.

JD Vance
Well, I wonder, Tim Walts, when were you ever in war?

When was this? What was this weapon that you carried into war?

Anne Flaherty
You know, it's interesting cause he's acknowledged as much. In a 2018 interview with Minnesota Public Radio, he said, I know that there are certainly folks that did more than.

Tim Walz
I did, and I know that willingly say I got far more out of the military than they got out of me.

Anne Flaherty
Then there's another issue that has actually come up, which is about his rank and walls. Right before he retired, he had achieved a rank of command sergeant major.

Tim Walz
I'm Tim Walz, and I'm running for Congress in Minnesota's first congressional district. I'm a retired command sergeant major. I spent 24 years in the Army National Guard.

Anne Flaherty
Command sergeant major is, it's the highest enlisted rank for his unit. It comes with a lot of responsibility, but you have to hang on to this job for three years and meet certain requirements in order to retire as a command sergeant major. We know that he achieved the rank in September, and he retired the following May. So we know that he didn't achieve those requirements to keep that rank. So, in fact, when you look at Walz's website, for example, as governor or the campaign website, it did cite that he was a command sergeant major.

Interestingly enough, yesterday, they changed the verbiage on that campaign site to say that he did not retire at that level. But he is a former command sergeant major, which is technically more accurate. Now, whether or not that amounts to stolen valor, which is a very explosive allegation. It even has legal implications. It's against federal law to lie about your military service to try to defraud the american public. You know, I think there are a lot of people who would argue that that accusation of stolen valor is over the top.

Brad Milke
Yeah. What, has there been a reaction from Democrats?

Anne Flaherty
You know, it was interesting because Wells, of course, he puts out a statement and he doesn't address a lot of these allegations, tit for tat. I mean, a lot of it can already be found in guard records and so forth, but he just tries to say at the end of the day, you know, the governor fired and trained others to use weapons of war innumerable times. Governor Walz would never insult or undermine an american's service to this country. In fact, he thanks Senator Vance for putting his life on the line for our country. It's the american way.

Brad Milke
They have no vision for the future.

All they can do is attack and lie.

Anne Flaherty
We heard from House Democrats yesterday in a call, people defending walls.

Brad Milke
They have no options but to try to do one of the worst things you can do in America, and that is to attack a veteran for their service.

Anne Flaherty
ABC News interviewed people who had served with Walz, and there were people who said he was a very good soldier. We talked with one person who said, you know, look, I don't like his politics. I'm not going to vote for him, but he's actually a pretty good guy. So, you know, a lot of people weighing in on this and saying, you know, why are you attacking how somebody served? The fact that he served for 24 years should speak for itself. Of course, Republicans saying it's not about that. It's about how he's framed it to the public and whether or not voters can trust him.

Brad Milke
Well, and there are people who have been like trying to defend walls by being like, who are you, JD Vance, like, you were a public affairs guy in the marines. But that can carry real risks in combat zones from what I've been told.

Anne Flaherty
Well, he was a writer for an internal writer. He was what they call a combat correspondent. You embed with units and then you write articles for internal publications to kind of boost morale. And, you know, I think one thing Vance would say, though, is that he never said otherwise.

JD Vance
I served in a combat zone. I never said that I saw a firefight myself. But I've always told the truth about my Marine Corps service.

Anne Flaherty
Is this going to get traction with voters? I don't know. I know that it's probably just the beginning of the next couple of months.

Brad Milke
Especially in a moment when the republican nominee has actually been convicted of a crime. So using this very loaded language about federal crimes that might have be going too far. We'll see sort of what effect it has. All right. Anne Flaherty, thank you so much.

Anne Flaherty
Thanks, Brad.

Brad Milke
Okay, one more quick break. When we come back, can it be a post pandemic Olympics when global authorities say there's still a pandemic? One last thing is next.

John Kerry
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Anne Flaherty
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Brad Milke
And one last thing.

Yesterday at the Olympics, we watched one of the most anticipated races of these games. Noah Lyles, the insanely charismatic sprinter from Florida, was trying to become the first American since Carl Lewis to win both the dash. He'd already won the 100, but as he started the two, he didn't quite seem himself. He finished third, he got a bronze. And then suddenly he looked really wobbly. And Noah, not looking like Noah at all and needed some medical assistance.

Leaving the arena after the race, Lyles confirmed that just a couple days prior, he had been diagnosed with Covid-19. And this is not the only time in the games we've seen this. In fact, what had been described as the first post Covid Olympics, the coronavirus, has clearly been spreading among athletes at one of the most important moments of their lives.

Unknown
Regarding Covid, it is confined to the water polo team. There have been five athletes in total who have tested positive.

Brad Milke
That was the head of Team Australia. Women's water polo team experienced an outbreak right as the games began. But that number did not stay at five for very long. At last count, 16 australian athletes in various sports have tested positive for Covid. A dozen more were hit by other respiratory infections. And this is not just Australia. American swimmers, a german decathlete, a british breaststroker, all positive. An official from the World Health Organization appeared at a United nations presser this week to say dozens of athletes have now been affected around the village.

Unknown
In recent months, regardless of the season, many countries have experienced surges of Covid-19, including at the Olympics.

Brad Milke
And this has raised uncomfortable questions of athletes, and especially these organizing committees.

Unlike past years, people who are still contagious for Covid are not barred from competing. They could, and they are infecting their teammates or perhaps even their opponents. This disease is unquestionably still with us. In fact, the Olympics happen to fall right as Europe has experienced a rise in cases.

Unknown
Overall test positivity is above 10%. But this fluctuates by region. In Europe, percent positivity is over 20%.

Brad Milke
So in the case of Noah Lyles, you could see him wearing a surgical mask indoors after his diagnosis, dutch athletes were told to be even more proactive, avoiding unnecessary interactions with those not on their teams. But the vast majority of teams here say they have not taken any particular mitigation efforts. The australian official talked about washing hands, which we know is not the primary way Covid spreads.

Unknown
We treat Covid no differently to any other respiratory illness, but we want to ensure that we have our protocols working as well.

Brad Milke
Now, the immediate consequences of contracting Covid are less severe than they were in 2020. For most people, Covid hospitalizations in 2021 dwarfed anything that we're seeing now. But Covid can still cause serious symptoms, especially in people with preexisting conditions. Think of Noah Lyles, who grew up with asthma. Long Covid is a concern. In fact, athletes in other sports have dealt with long comebacks and early retirements because of it. It's easy to say, listen, I want the full Olympic experience that I was deprived of three years ago. But you got to think to yourself, are watch parties and cafeteria dinners in the Olympic village worth potentially giving up your career? Public health experts say we have the tools. Vaccines, masks and regular testing regimens have all been shown to slow the spread. But ultimately, in Paris, protective measures have largely been left up to the athletes themselves. And in these games, losing just a few hundredths of a second can define a legacy.

I'm so upset the Olympics are ending, like closing ceremonies on Sunday, and there are still sports I haven't even watched yet. Like, I gotta get some climbing in, I gotta watch some sailing, some taekwondo. And by the way, breaking, like the new sport that I've been dying to watch for years now I gotta see these kids dance their hearts out. This weekend, start here is produced by Kelly Torres, Jen Neumann, Brenda Salinas Baker, Vika Aronson, Cameron Chertavian, Anthony, Ali, Maura, Milwaukee and Amira Williams. Ariel Chester is our social media producer. Josh Cohan is director of podcast programming. I'm our managing editor. Laura Mayer is our executive producer. Thanks to Lakia Brown, John Newman, Tara Gimble and Liz Alessi. Special thanks this week to Chris Berry, Connor Burton, Jenna Harrison, Bruno Rober and Stephanie Maurice. I'm Brad Milke. I'm off Monday, but I'll see you next week.

John Kerry
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