Surgeon General: Social Media Kills

This episode discusses the potential dangers of social media on mental health, especially among youth, prompting a call from the Surgeon General for health warning labels on social media apps.

1. Surgeon General Vivek Murthy advocates for tobacco-style health warnings on social media apps to combat a youth mental health crisis.
2. Extensive social media use is linked to increased anxiety and depression among teens.
3. Personal stories from affected families highlight the potentially deadly consequences of social media challenges.
4. Legislative action is necessary to implement these warnings, yet political and corporate inertia remains a significant barrier.
5. The episode underscores a broader discussion on how to make social media safer, especially for younger users.

1. Introduction to the Issue

The episode opens with the Surgeon General's call for social media warnings, drawing parallels to cigarette health warnings. Vivek Murthy: "Warning kids and parents about the harms associated with social media is urgent because it's part of addressing the broader mental health crisis that we're living through."

2. Deep Dive with Elizabeth Scholze

ABC’s Elizabeth Scholze discusses the specifics of the proposed warnings and the evidence supporting the Surgeon General's concerns. Vivek Murthy: "Social media has not been proven to be safe for kids. There is mounting evidence of harms associated with social media use."

3. Personal Stories

The episode shares a poignant story from a family affected by a social media challenge that led to tragedy, highlighting the real-world impacts of online content. Elizabeth Scholze: "They had an hour of screen time a day... And yet they couldn't stop him from seeing this challenge on the app at that one moment in time. And it cost him his life."

1. Limit daily social media usage to reduce exposure to harmful content.
2. Engage in open conversations with children about the content they encounter online.
3. Monitor social media usage and set parental controls where necessary.
4. Educate children about the potential dangers of online challenges and peer pressure.
5. Advocate for safer social media policies and support legislative changes.

Surgeon General Vivek Murthy presses for a warning label on social media apps. The Biden White House announces new policies to more easily grant legal status to certain immigrants. And Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu dissolves his war cabinet.

People

Vivek Murthy, Elizabeth Scholze

Companies

ABC News

Content Warnings:

Discussions of mental health issues and a tragic death related to social media usage.

Brad Mielke
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It's Tuesday, June 18. Cigarettes can kill you. What about that other box in your pocket? We start here.

The surgeon general demands kids social media apps feature a health warning.

Vivek Murthy
It's part of addressing the broader mental health crisis that we're living through.

Brad Mielke
But could this actually save lives? Some parents say absolutely. Meanwhile, the Biden administration that upended asylum rules is setting up new policies to protect immigrants.

Joe Biden
Some people are going to see this as maybe a 2021.

Brad Mielke
This just came out this morning. We'll break it all down. And he's already lost members of his war cabinet. Now he's shutting the whole thing down.

Vivek Murthy
Get rid of this corrupted government that does not release the hostages.

Brad Mielke
Why? Some Israelis are protesting the latest decision by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

From ABC News, this is start here. I'm Brad milked.

Lots of items come with warning labels on them, right? Cleaning products, alcohol, music albums with bad words on them. Perhaps the most famous instance of warning labels, though, came when cigarettes started including dire messages about health risks. These did have a profound impact on smoking because, a, cigarettes were being used by everyone, so any new variable could make a big difference. And b, these warnings came from the surgeon general himself. Well, yesterday, the nation's top doctor, surgeon General Vivek Murthy, came out with a new announcement. He warrants warning labels on social media apps. ABC's Elizabeth Scholze has been following this. In fact, she got an interview with the surgeon general yesterday. So, Elizabeth, thanks for being with us. He wants what, like the cigarette label on your home screen or like on the Facebook app? What is this?

Elizabeth Scholze
Yeah, I mean, that's exactly it, Brad. The surgeon general wants there to be these tobacco style warning labels on social media apps. And he says this is because of the moment that we are in right now that he calls a youth mental.

Vivek Murthy
Health crisis making social media safer for our kids. Warning kids and parents about the harms associated with social media is urgent because it's part of addressing the broader mental health crisis that we're living through.

Elizabeth Scholze
The surgeon general penned an op ed in the New York Times early yesterday morning. And then when we talked to him, he said that this is the defining public health issue of our time, because what he is seeing is that social media is increasingly linked to negative outcomes for mental health among younger americans.

Vivek Murthy
Social media, number one, has not been proven to be safe for kids. And number two, there is mounting evidence of harms associated with social media use. So we wanna make sure that parents and kids know that. And that's where a warning label comes into play.

Elizabeth Scholze
He pointed out data to us, Brad, that shows that teens who spend more than 3 hours a day on social media double their risk of anxiety and depression symptoms. And he says that the average time spent on social media for that age group is nearly 5 hours a day.

Vivek Murthy
I worry that there are millions of children who are currently at risk. And keep in mind also that 95% of adolescents are using social media. And so this is a widespread concern.

Elizabeth Scholze
He is making the point that this is an urgent issue that needs to be addressed. In fact, he says, the US is already behind in taking steps to understand the impact of social media on younger americans. And a warning label would be a necessary first step to try to raise awareness about the risks and also potentially limit some of the screen time from those users online.

Brad Mielke
I mean, to be classified as one of the more serious health risks of our time. I mean, how dire are we talking about from his point of view and from family's points of view?

Elizabeth Scholze
We have heard from so many families, Brad, around the country, who are struggling with how to put limitations on social media. This is ingrained in so many people's day to day lives, and yet there can be really dire consequences. And we had the chance to sit down with Todd and Mia. Minority. There are a couple in Maryland whose twelve year old son tragically died a couple of years ago because he was trying a viral challenge on social media where you try to choke yourself. The idea is that you enter a brief state of euphoria while you are doing this challenge.

Vivek Murthy
That morning, he woke up, he wasn't feeling well. He said his throat was hurting, and, you know, he was, you know, little, you know, discombobulated, really, the quiet.

He wasn't, you know, itself.

Elizabeth Scholze
And, you know, they had limits in their family. They had an hour of screen time a day. They were aware generally of where their kid was and when he was using his phone and when he wasn't. And yet they couldn't stop him from seeing this challenge on the app at that one moment in time. And it cost him his life.

Vivek Murthy
I've been through a lot of things but that really knocked me out. I mean, I just.

I mean, it just didn't seem like reality.

Elizabeth Scholze
It was heartbreaking to hear their story and to hear how Matthew's death, their son's death, has prompted them to enter into the world of advocacy.

Vivek Murthy
If we don't change things, you could look like us. You could have the same experience that we had. Every day we get up, we have the realization that our son isn't here. Yeah, I mean, do they know what that feels like?

Elizabeth Scholze
The minors decided to attend a hearing in January on Capitol Hill, where CEO's of the biggest tech companies were grilled about what steps they're taking to actually change their platforms to make them safer for kids.

Brad Mielke
Would you like to apologize for what you've done to these good people?

Elizabeth Scholze
In that hearing, there was a very stunning moment, Brad, where Mark Zuckerberg turned around and apologized directly to those families.

Brad Mielke
I'm sorry for each one.

Elizabeth Scholze
Including to the minors who were sitting there before everything started.

Vivek Murthy
We kind of gave our cards out and we just asked the social media platforms, work with us. You know, we tried to. We tried to give olive branch work with us and other parents that have lost children to help make your platform better for everybody, you know.

Elizabeth Scholze
And what has their response been to you?

Vivek Murthy
No response.

Elizabeth Scholze
Nothing?

Vivek Murthy
Nothing.

Elizabeth Scholze
They hear that apology. They hear lawmakers say they want to do something about safety online, and yet nothing has changed. And at this point, what the minors told us, and I think a lot of other families say something needs to change.

Brad Mielke
Well, and so, like, such a sympathetic story, and yet is a warning the thing to do it like, like would in the eyes of the surgeon general, does something like a warning on an app actually have an effect on how people use that app?

Elizabeth Scholze
Right. And I think even the surgeon general acknowledges this is one step of many that would need to be taken to really make a difference in the user experience for younger people online. But what he says is when you look at the data for what these labels did for products like tobacco, it did work. It was one important step that helped cut the number of smokers in the US from 42% to 12% over the course of 50 years, which is a pretty significant decline. On the other hand, Murthy made very clear to us that Congress needs to also pass more comprehensive legislation that would, for example, force tech companies to change their design so they don't always send push notifications, auto scrolling these features that hook people in and keep them on, design them a little bit more intentionally so that users could be safer online, especially young kids. There's also bipartisan support for not having these companies collect the data on younger users. But, you know, is it going to make a difference? What the surgeon general said is we're already behind. We need to do something. And this is a first step, like.

Brad Mielke
Make the product healthier instead of just warning about the unhealthy product and yet the warning being the first step there. But on this particular thing, you said he wants Congress to do more in these other areas. Does Congress? He can't just implement this himself, it sounds like. Right. Where does Congress stand on a warning label system like this?

Elizabeth Scholze
Right. This would need to be approved by Congress. And currently, there isn't legislation pending in either the House or the Senate that would put these warning labels in place. So this is the first sort of call to arms here from the surgeon general.

There is separate legislation, at least in the Senate, that would put some new limitations on big tech companies when it comes to the experience for kids and teens, that legislation has bipartisan support. It has yet to pass. And that is not something that's surprising in Congress. And even if it did pass the Senate, Brad, not totally clear that it would pass the house. So this is one of those issues. We hear lawmakers on both sides say they're hearing from families and their constituents about the need to do something about this mental health crisis that, in part, stems from social media.

We hear this urgent warning from the surgeon general. We hear the tech companies say they understand more needs to be done, and yet here we are. Nothing has been done. I think the hope from the surgeon general is this might at least reinvigorate the conversation a little bit.

Brad Mielke
Well, and that's the thing. Like, from a parent's perspective, I feel like that's what's so frustrating is you hear lawmakers sounding so unified, so bipartisan over this. You hear Facebook and X and all these social media companies saying, like, we care about our young users. And yet, for some reason, when those lawmakers get together to actually vote on something, it does not seem nearly as bipartisan anymore. And the algorithms certainly continue, as experts say, to be very addictive to young people. All right, Elizabeth Scholze, fascinating interview here. Thank you so much.

Elizabeth Scholze
Thank you so much, Brad.

Brad Mielke
Next up on start here, Congress hasn't acted on immigration either, but that's not stopping the Biden administration this morning. New executive action after the break.

Joe Biden
Whoa.

Vivek Murthy
Landing an account this big will totally change my landscaping business. It's gonna mean hiring more guys and more equipment and new trucks for the new guys to drive the new equipment in.

I don't know if I'm ready.

Elizabeth Scholze
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Brad Mielke
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Vivek Murthy
The simple truth is there is a worldwide migrant crisis, and if the United States doesn't secure our border, there's no limit to the number of people may try to come here.

Brad Mielke
When President Biden made the decision to crack down on illegal border crossings this month by revoking the right to an automatic asylum hearing for those who arrive on our soil, it was seen by many as an admission that our immigration system is indeed broken.

Vivek Murthy
Frankly, I would have preferred to address this issue through a bipartisan legislation.

Brad Mielke
Biden said himself that the reason we can't accommodate this many asylum seekers is that Congress has allocated too few resources to the judges, lawyers, and border agents who have to process them. It was also seen by some as a political maneuver to get out in front of Republicans who are running this fall on immigration. However, if this convinced some Americans in the center that President Biden's doing his best, it also infuriated immigration advocates. You're always talking about people doing stuff the right way. Well, the US has made the right way almost impossible. What are you going to do to protect hardworking migrants who come to this country, then contribute to it for years? Well, as we post this, the Biden White House has just announced new actions to keep certain immigrants inside the country legally. ABC's Armando Garcia is our lead producer on immigration. Armando, can you explain this new announcement from the Biden White House?

Joe Biden
Hey, Brad, thanks for having me. The president is expected to announce two different actions that will provide immigration relief for undocumented spouses and children of us citizens and some so called dreamers and DACA recipients. These are migrants who were brought to the US as kids. Let's tackle that first announcement. First, this new program will aim to facilitate the process through which undocumented spouses can adjust their status and apply for lawful permanent residence if they're married to a citizen. To be eligible for this program, spouses of us citizens must be present in the United States without having been admitted or paroled, and must have lived in the US for at least ten years as of June 17, 2024. They also must have been legally married to a us citizen as of the same date, and must also pass background checks.

Brad Mielke
Well, wait, Armando. Spouses and children of us citizens. I thought, like, get residency or, like, get immigration status, right? So how does this change from the current situation?

Joe Biden
Yeah, absolutely. But look, some of our listeners might be surprised to know that marrying a us citizen is not a golden ticket, and most importantly, doesn't equate to a green card. Under these same existing laws, undocumented spouses who wish to adjust their status are sometimes required to return to their home country to apply for status, and they're susceptible to a ten year ban from returning to the United States. So you can imagine, Brad, if someone without lawful permanent status marries a us citizen, and now they're suddenly being told to return to Mexico or to wherever they're from, a country perhaps, that they haven't been to in a very long time, apply for residence in the United States, but you might not be able to return for ten years and reunite with your loved one. That is a tough pill to swallow. And I think that's exactly what the Biden administration is trying to address with this new action.

Brad Mielke
Interesting. Okay, so it's almost taking existing law and saying, hey, this, everything is the same, except you don't have to go back to your home country to do the whole rigmarole.

You mentioned DACA recipients also like so called dreamers. What is the Biden administration announcing there?

Joe Biden
So this is the second announcement that the Biden administration is making. It's an action that aims to facilitate the process of obtaining work visas for DACA recipients and other dreamers. I still consider myself a dreamer in the sense that I'm a DACA recipient, but I'm done dreaming. I want a real life.

Brad Mielke
But what is your dream?

Joe Biden
Stability. That's what I want, and I don't have that right now because I'm living my life in two year increments. It aims to streamline the process to get certain work visas, such as h one B visas. Perhaps that's what most of our listeners have heard of, but this could provide additional deportation relief and a possible pathway to a more permanent residency for DACA recipients and other dreamers.

Brad Mielke
You've renewed your DACA status at least four or five times.

Joe Biden
You've spent, what, probably close to $10,000.

Brad Mielke
$10,000?

Joe Biden
Yeah, probably something like that. I think it shows that the american dream has, you know, in many ways, left us out. Unfortunately, the idea is that in order to apply, applicants must have graduated from an accredited higher education institution in the US and have a high skill job offer from us employer that aligns with what they studied for. So when we think of h one B visas, we often think of careers in STEM. But the administration officials that we spoke to say that this will not be limited to those fields, that it will encompass others.

Vivek Murthy
Until Congress acts, I'm going to keep using every tool of my disposal as president of the United States to preserve and protect DACA, keep fighting for dreamers.

Joe Biden
And so we're still waiting on some details about how this is going to play out. We hear that the State Department might issue additional guidance about who might be eligible for this. But look, the administration has basically, since day one, said, we have educated these dreamers, these migrants who were brought to the US as kids. Why not give them a chance to work here and contribute to the United States? I believe this is just another pathway that they're trying to achieve that.

Brad Mielke
Hey, but Armando, let me ask you, is all this kind of nibbling away at the edges? Like, I would think that if the Biden administration really wanted to, like, make a huge new executive action on DACA recipients, I imagine they would have tried that already. Right? Is this more of a. Because it's an election year? Is this more about messaging than policy? Like telling Latinos, hey, remember, DACA recipients futures are at stake, please vote for me. Is that what this is, or is this a real significant policy shift?

Joe Biden
Well, I think a lot of people are going to see the writing on the wall here, and they know that immigration is a vulnerable issue for this administration. Right. And I think some people are going to see this as maybe a 2024 stunt. Right. However, this is something that the administration has been fighting for since day one. This is not the first time that we have heard for some of these rights or some of these processes to be put in place. And again, I think the administration is basically trying to show, look, we agree that the immigration system is broken. We agree that there should be more restrictions to asylum, but that there should also be legal pathways for gaining a residency here in the United States. So I think that that's something that they're trying to address, and I don't think we should lose sight of the fact that they might be right, that they are limited into what they can do.

For example, the deferred action program, this has been something that's been sued into oblivion for many, many years. It's been under litigation. It was repeatedly ruled unlawful. Right now that program is essentially ended for new applicants. Only current applicants can renew. And this is a two year work permit. Right. So a lot of these people are working under the premise that, look, in two years of my deferred action status does not get renewed, I might face deportation. I think that this is just another pathway that the administration is trying to open up and to show their commitment to protecting dreamers.

Brad Mielke
Really interesting. Yeah. Yeah. You could make a bigger, like, executive action if you wanted, but it would almost certainly be challenged in court and perhaps struck down. Maybe this is the safer route. All right. Armando Garcia covering immigration. Thank you so much. Really interesting.

Joe Biden
Thanks, Brad.

Brad Mielke
We talked yesterday about a so called tactical pause in Gaza in which Israel says it will hold its fire throughout a certain aid route. During daylight hours. Yesterday, this policy appeared to take effect, but on that same day, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu made a policy shift within his own government. He disbanded his war cabinet. Let's bring in ABC's foreign correspondent Jordana Miller, who's based in Jerusalem. Jordana, can you explain this? What does this mean?

Jordana Miller
Well, the israeli prime minister faced a real problem once centrist General Benny Gantz quit the government, and that was that. Suddenly there was a vacancy, a seat open in the war cabinet. And Netanyahu's far right ministers, particularly Itamar Benfir, had said, if you don't give me that seat inside the war cabinet, I'm going to bolt the government, leave with my party. That will bring down the government. And of course, that would mean that Netanyahu would be out of power.

So Netanyahu decided instead of going through a political fight with Itamar Benveer, and there's many problems that would arise if he were in the war cabinet. Remember, the far right opposes a ceasefire.

Some in the far right want to militarily reoccupy the Gaza Strip. Some want to resettle Gaza. Some even want to move Palestinians out of the Gaza Strip. This is what Itamar Benvir and the far right stand for. And they not only are a political problem for Netanyahu because they constantly pull him more and more to the right, but they are a diplomatic problem for Netanyahu because everything they stand for runs, you know, in stark contrast to the positions of the United States. So Netanyahu wisely said, well, who needs a war cabinet, right?

I don't need to go through this fight. I'm going to dissolve the war cabinet, and I'll just consult my closest advisors, like Ron Dermer and obviously the defense minister, yov Gallant, and his national security advisor.

Those are the three or four people he will consult and make the most sensitive decisions for the war. And then he'll bring some of those decisions to the larger security cabinet where he can stack it in his favor. And so essentially he was able to sideline the far right. The bad news for Israelis who are interested in how decisions are being made is that now it all seems much more. It will become more opaque.

Brad Mielke
Right. Like more cloistered, essentially. Right.

Jordana Miller
Yeah. There won't be.

I mean, the advantage of having a centrist like General Benny Gantz in the war cabinet is that there were leaks and people found out what was being discussed. Right. You know, Netanyahu's closest advisors are not going to be talking to the press as much or leaking. So it's going to be more difficult for Israelis to understand what decisions are on the table, how the decisions are being made.

And that gives Netanyahu, by the way, more power. He can control the decisions and the messaging of the war.

Brad Mielke
So then if we're talking about a smaller group of people making decisions, then even if they are closer to Netanyahu, what does that mean for a ceasefire? Does that mean that he's more or less likely to go along with a deal? I mean, does it change the calculus here?

Jordana Miller
Because Netanyahu is still going to be consulting with the defense minister and of course, the head of the israeli army and the head of the Mossad. I mean, there still will be debates about what the next steps should be.

But there was certainly a lot of criticism from General Benny Gantz about Netanyahu's strategy with the yisis fire and hostage deal negotiations.

And in a way, with him gone from the war cabinet, it may allow Netanyahu to continue in the path he's been taking, which some feel he's just simply not doing enough to close that hostage deal and cease fire. He hasn't given the mediators the kind of flexibility they've been asking for for a long time.

For some Israelis, Netanyahu's decision to dissolve the cabinet was just a sign of more dysfunction.

Vivek Murthy
We have the enemies within, which are mostly radical people that are trying to pull Israel into an endless war.

Jordana Miller
We've seen increasing numbers of Israelis taking to the streets, calling for early elections.

Vivek Murthy
Get rid of this corrupted government that does not release the hostages.

Jordana Miller
But Netanyahu has a 64 seat majority.

And unless one of the parties pulls out or four people peel off and bolt, you know, right now his government is still secure.

Brad Mielke
Yeah, definitely a move of a political survival for Netanyahu. And then we'll see sort of if this changes the calculus. The initial readout then appears to be no. All right. Jordana Miller there in Jerusalem. Thank you so much.

Jordana Miller
Thanks, Brad.

Brad Mielke
Ok, one more quick break. When we come back, you thought drive thru workers couldn't get any more confusing until computers try doing their job. One last thing is next.

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Hi, I'm Alexis Ohanian.

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Brad Mielke
And one last thing, they haven't been loving it for years, and now it's gone. For the last few years, McDonald's has been testing a new piece of technology at some of its drive throughs, automated order taking, where you talk to electronic voice software instead of a human. The idea is it will save time and money for the humans there. And since its inception, well, the system hasnt always worked flawlessly. This clip went viral on TikTok a couple years ago when a customer named Madeline Cameron ended up ordering four ketchup packets and two butters.

Elizabeth Scholze
Where did the butter come from?

Joe Biden
I would just like a large water and a cup of ice cream.

Jordana Miller
There's no saving this.

Joe Biden
We need to just go and tell them.

Brad Mielke
I didn't even know you could order butter at McDonald's. Maybe for the pancakes. But when the system tried to give her caramel sundaes a much more complicated order than just a vanilla ice cream, she gave up mcdonalds.

Joe Biden
I'm done.

Brad Mielke
Well, recently, McDonald's announced it's discontinuing this experiment.

In a statement yesterday, they told us their automated ordering partnership with IBM will wrap up later this year. The trade publication restaurant business says this feature will likely be gone next month. Several fast food chains have jumped head first into this new era of ordering. McDonald's had actually been among the more deliberate companies, perhaps understanding their failures would be much more public. Sure enough, this TikToker named Wren Adams went viral last year when she tried to keep correcting the machine, only to end up with more items popping up on screen.

Joe Biden
For some reason, she took the Diet Coke off and made it nine sweet teaspoon.

Brad Mielke
Nine.

Joe Biden
I did not ask for this.

Brad Mielke
One person couldn't choose between 20 piece and ten piece nuggets and ended up with 210 orders racking up and is this type of order? You can imagine where the rapidly accelerating pace of AI could improve things. Recent iterations of chat GPT have placed an emphasis on being able to interrupt the system or interrupt yourself in the middle of a thought. After all, that's how we talk, right? You don't get everything right the first time. Maybe its with that in mind that McDonalds explicitly says the push to have robots take your order isnt done. Quote as we move forward, our work with IBM has given us the confidence that a voice ordering solution for drive thru will be part of our restaurants future. End quote with the prospect of using fewer paid humans at the window, this clearly seems like the future of fast food, but might not come as fast as you thought.

The statement yesterday also said theyve captured many learnings, which is something I've never heard in a human conversation. So maybe they have learned a lot from these language models. More on all these stories@abcnews.com or the ABC News app I'm Brad Milke. See you tomorrow.

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