Steven Van Zandt | Club Random with Bill Maher

Bill Maher
My new book, what this comedian said will shock you, is out in two days. May 21, he met with me, and. I said to him, straight up, I said, listen, if this is gonna be about Bruce, you know, I understand that. Okay. Right.

Steven Van Zandt
But let's stop this right now.

Who's gonna know about this stuff? You think they're not gonna be playing born to run in 100 years? Oh, please. I hope you're right, Claude Randall, since I'm not sure, I have no sense of time, really. But since I saw you, was it more than a year ago?

Bill Maher
Maybe it was breakfast at the polo lounge. When we breakfast, we had eggs at one in the afternoon. More than a year ago, you think? Oh, yes. I would say three.

Steven Van Zandt
Oh, okay. Then, yes. I mean, soul fire was just out. Oh, all right, all right. What year was that?

That's 2017. No, no, no, no. It was after that. The summer of sorcery was 2019, maybe. It was my second album.

Bill Maher
I do. It's funny what your mind remembers. I remember. Well, probably because I play it all the time. It's a great album.

Soul fire. Oh, thank you. Soul fire. I mean, the title track is great. What's that ballad you sing?

The city weeps at night, weeps tonight. That's a great. Real doo up. You have real chops. No, I swear, it's like singing.

I don't think people know that. I mean, that is a song that you'd never hear in the E Street band. You know, it's almost doo wop. Right? It is doo wop.

It is doo wop. It's really pretty authentic duo. It's very authentic. It's awesome. I love that genre, which is really a lost genre, you know?

Billy Joel did. Yes. You know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Big hits, you know, uptown girl.

Steven Van Zandt
Yeah. What was that? And then there was another one that was, of course, deliberately in that style. Yeah. He's a big four Seasons fan.

Bill Maher
Right. As am I. I open for them. Really? Yes.

When I was 26, I was. I did one tonight show or something, and I opened for Diana Ross and then in Las Vegas, and then I opened for Frankie Valli on the tour. Oh, no, no. I'm sorry. This was right before my first Tonight show.

I did the tour when right to the. This was. 1982, was their 20th anniversary tour. I was even on the tour bus. That was horrible.

As long times have you been on a tour bus? See what we go through in the rock and roll world, right? What? I mean, the old days. The old days.

Steven Van Zandt
Tour bus was a step up. Right. You know, from the station wagons and. Oh, the van. Right.

Yeah. Yeah. Tour bus. You were kind of starting to make it, you know. Right.

Bill Maher
You have a bus. You know, some guy. You're right. Everything's relative. Some guys don't have a bus.

Steven Van Zandt
No. But now it's a plane, which is great. Yeah. And I know you're a big revolutionary, but I hope you don't ever feel guilty. All the environment stuff, any of it.

Bill Maher
Having money is not a crime. Oh, no, no, no. I got no problem with that, you know? Well, good, because I'm broke most of the time. Really?

What are you talking. Why are you broke? Well, I got a big. I got a big overhead. You got a big nut.

Steven Van Zandt
Yeah, big, big nut. Yeah, I got. I got. You know. What's your nut?

Bill Maher
What's in your nut? Well, I got a record company that, you know, loses money. Barely breaks even. My entire radio network loses money, but. The garage band won.

Steven Van Zandt
Oh, yeah. Oh, so good. Yeah. No, that's what I mean. Well, you know, I mean, this is your.

Bill Maher
The thing I feel like that is most in your DNA, is, one, integrity. You do what you like, what you want, what you think is important, and two, it never aligns with what the public may think. You're so right. You are so right. It's like, you know, and you can't worry about it, you know, because I feel like I'm doing good work, you know?

Steven Van Zandt
And that's what counts. Yeah. And you're not exactly starving. No, no, no. I don't mean to be a whining rock star.

God. You're not whining at all. No, I'm not just. I'm just like me. And money just don't get along too well.

You know what I mean? I just don't really. I'm not an entrepreneurial guy. You got that shirt. I can't.

Bill Maher
I mean, that thing doesn't look cheap at all. Where'd you get that shirt? I don't know. What do you don't know? That's how rich you are.

But you don't know? There was a time in my life if you went through my closet. And where'd you get that? I can tell you exactly where I got that. Cause I had four shirts.

My first sport jacket that I bought for doing stand up cost $5. $5. And then I had it tailored, which cost 20. The tailoring cost four times what the jacket was, but I had my $25 jacket. I still have it.

Steven Van Zandt
So you opened for the Four Seasons? That's me. I did, too. What with the Dovels. You opened for the Four Seasons?

Yeah. We have that in common. Yes. What year? 1973.

Bill Maher
Wow. I joined a group called the Dovels, which had a couple of big hits in the early sixties. The Dovels. Terrific story. That was before my time.

Steven Van Zandt
Oh, yeah, yeah. The Dovels. Yeah. They had you can't sit down. And Bristol Stomp.

Terrific record. You can't sit down. What was that about a cola's note? You can't sit down. Hemorrhoids.

It's a dance thing. A dance thing. Oh, I see. That's so funny. At my age, I hear the patient can't sit down.

Bill Maher
I think hemorrhoids. Not that I have hemorrhoids, but I know people who do and travel with a pillow. But of course, when you're 16, you're thinking, you can't sit down. You got to get up and dance. Okay.

Steven Van Zandt
Not a bad idea for a commercial, however. Right? So there you go. Make a fortune. But anyway, yeah, I just by some chance, you know, ended up in the backup band for the dovels.

And I was so glad I got to Vegas in 73. It was like the last year the mob was there, you know? So I got a chance to see the old Vegas, you know, before the new Disneyland, Vegas, you know? And it was really different. It was really different.

I'm glad I got a chance to see it now. When you say last year of mob rule, it's not like their contract ran out, but I know what you mean. There was. There was an era, and a lot of people say that era was better when the. No doubt about it.

Bill Maher
I'm sure that's not true. If you were buried in a shallow grave in the desert, you know that. You know, recently, this is true in the paper, like two years ago when we had horrible drought, you know that out here, we've had it forever. Luckily, we've had rain recently, but. And Lake Mead, like, got to the lowest level ever.

So, like, where there had been water forever and they found, like, tons of bodies. Pinky rings. Like just a skeleton with a pink. Oh, man. Yeah.

I mean, there was a lot of shit down there. But. But I. But I agree. It probably was better when it was more of a rat packy town.

That's what it's meant. It's an adult playground. Yeah, but. But here's the thing. First of all, it was only like seven or eight casinos and.

Steven Van Zandt
And nothing in between. So we played. We played flamingo, just the strip. When they said the strip. I remember even when I was there in 82, it was just one road.

Bill Maher
Every hotel on either side of one road. That's not Vegas now, but a long. Way from each other. You know, we played at Flamingo and Caesars was like three football fields away at the end of the block, you know, and nothing in between, you know what I mean? Nothing in between.

Steven Van Zandt
No. No land, I'm telling you. Really? Yes. There was nothing.

There was literally seven or eight casinos on the entire strip, other than downtown. The Riviera, the sand. The Desert inn. The Desert inn. The dunes.

Bill Maher
Dunes, right. Flamingo, maybe the original. Yes. Probably still. Which I was thrilled, right.

Caesar's palace is probably the end of the block. You're right. Yeah. It was diagonal. There was no Luxor.

There was no. No, but here's the thing. The whole intention of the town was to make money from gambling and nothing but gambling, right? So, you know, these buffets, you know, were like 279. Lobster and steak, you know, the rooms were $29.

You know what I mean? Yes. You know, the lounge was $6 and Frank Sinatra could walk in, you know, $6. So. And here's the mob probably lounge.

You mean the. Not the main. Not the main room, but there was a main room and then there was a lounge. You know, that's what, to me, that's what Vegas is missing the most currently is there's no lounge acts. Yeah.

Steven Van Zandt
That changed. Yeah. Which is a shame, because that's where you saw Don Rickles. Yeah. At first.

Bill Maher
Or you could see acts who were coming up or on their way down. Yeah. And you could. And it was. And it happened at like eleven at night, midnight, two in the morning.

It's a late town. Like, if you want to do something after, like when I work there, I'm playing at the same time. All the other shows are. When I'm done, everything's done. And then people go to discos.

I don't go to a disco. Yeah. Yeah. So they are. They're making nothing but money from the gambling.

Steven Van Zandt
The mob's probably grabbing a third off the top. Right. And everybody still got rich. And everybody got rich with no money from entertainment, food or rooms. Right.

With the mob taking a third off the top. And everybody still got rich. Well, they had entertainment pretty much from the beginning. Yeah. But they was a lost leader, whatever they call it.

They probably lost money. It may still be a loss leader. It was always meant to be. Yeah. Now they make money from everything.

They charge you for the fucking Wi Fi now. I mean, you know. You know. Right. I mean, you know, they're not gonna.

They don't leave a dollar on the. Fucking tv and they don't know how to treat people anymore. Oh, no, I mean, that's not really. Yeah, unless you're a whale, you know, unless you're a big gamer. Right.

Bill Maher
You know, but even the entertainment, I mean, they've been very nice to me. I was at the mirage for a long time and now I'm at the MGM grand. They're great. I mean, they're very nice people. It's just that, you know, the way the hotel business is, you just can't.

You know. I mean, I blame the millennials. I'm sorry, but I do. I mean, like, I have this thing, long running thing. And I guess if you want to say that this makes me a diva, okay, but you're wrong.

It's not. All I want in my room is a fan. Just one person who's watched all my shows. No, no, an electric fan. I just want an electric fan because it never gets cold enough in the room.

Right. Do you like it cold when you. Sleep in a hotel room? Not too cold, but. Yeah, I know what you mean.

I like it cold. Get under the COVID Okay, so. And also for noise, you know, white noise. I like the sound of a fan. But I just.

It helps me sleep. It's harder for me to sleep on the road. So like. Okay, you call up, can you put an electric fan on the road? If you can't, just say no.

But these are five star hotels. Of course we can. Of course. You know, for Mister Mar. What else can we.

You know, it's like nothing. Just. Just a fan. Water. Again, I don't think this makes me a giant diva.

And again, if you can't do it, just say so. But they say so. And then you get there. It just seems impossible for a simple message to be transferred for more than one or two people, you know? I hear you.

And I feel like this has great repercussions for our country in general. Because if they can't get a fan in my room, I can kind of see why they can't close the border if they want to. Just, you know, whatever the direct correlation. I do. I just think people just can't fucking do anything anymore.

Steven Van Zandt
Well, yeah, I think you're right. And part of the problem, of course, is this. They got bigger and bigger and bigger. Right. You know, until now, there's three, 4000 rooms.

Whatever they are. That's it. Of course. You know, so what are you gonna do with that? Plus, since COVID nobody wants to work, so they're having trouble finding workers.

All the hotels that we tour always had 24 hours room service. Not anymore. Right. You know, they can't find people to work. So partly that, partly the bigness and partly the corporatization of everything.

Bill Maher
Yes. Where nobody gives a shit. One more thing that Frank Sinatra, I really feel, had going for him that got him great service. The threat of violence. And I feel that is what's missing in our.

We don't have enough threat of violence so that they're like, oh, the fan. We put three fans in that room. No, they know I'm not gonna do anything to them. So it was better when Vegas read it. That's all I'm saying.

A little threat of violence is not the worst thing in the world. You're not wrong. When you're running a government, you're not wrong. I mean, why do we have police? I mean, what is that?

And military threat of violence? Yeah, if you get out of line too much, we allow a monopoly on violence. You know, you're allowed. You know, there are people who go into the army. Cause they're like, yeah, I'm allowed to shoot somebody.

And cops, I mean, you know, some of them certainly enjoy, well, authority, shall. We say, too much sometimes. Joy. Authority. Now, keep in mind, I hold the biggest police fundraiser in the country.

I am a big supporter of the. You know that. I know you are. And a critic, and they deserve it. And I am an independent law and order liberal, which, you know, that's how I describe myself.

That's great. And now in New York, we have the opposite problem going on where the police have their hands tied behind their backs and they can't arrest anybody anymore, you know? Exactly. And they're going crazy. You know, we have five people, I think, thrown on the subway tracks in the past week or two, you know, two people in my neighborhood punching women in the face.

Steven Van Zandt
You know, the no bail thing was big for a minute. You know, you can punch a cop in the face and be back on the street the next day. It is amazing, the recidivism, the number of. I mean, I read these stats many times. Like a third of all the, like, smash and grab type of stuff or, like, petty robberies are, like, by the same 600 people who just keep being put back out there to do it.

Bill Maher
Some of them have done it dozens and dozens, I think, maybe even 100 times. Insane. And this law that you can steal anything under $1,000 and it's okay. I mean, who comes up with these fucking things? I'm so glad you're saying this because I feel like I'm always in this position where I'm having to explain to people, okay, I'm still the liberal I always was, but this kind of woke shit, if I can use that word.

This is not liberalism. Liberalism was never about, yeah, let's legalize crime. Yeah. I mean, it began with the privatization of prisons, which is the most insane concept ever. And that's more of a right wing thing, you know.

Steven Van Zandt
I mean, it's insane. It's a corporate thing. Yeah, that's agreed. Corporations should take over as much as they possibly can. That's definitely a right wing thing.

I mean, you know, hey, let's make crime profitable. Right. What a concept that is. Right. So, I mean, there's that going on.

On the other side. Yes. And look, you know, you're totally right, though. I mean, look up top, you know, at the higher echelons, it's mostly a republican problem, and then locally it's a democratic problem. Okay.

Certainly in my neighborhood, you know, I. Mean, so you still live in the old neighborhood? I'm in a village in Greenwich Village. Right. You know, and it was the best neighborhood in New York.

It was the best neighborhood in New York. And now it's terrible. It was just totally peaceful. And hippies and artists, artist type people. Bohemian.

Bohemian, you know, and safe. You know, I live a half a block from Washington Square park. Right. Living near a park. Used to be beachfront property.

Bill Maher
Right. Now they're homeless encampments, you know. Right. And, you know, and there's nobody solving these problems. Again, if I may, the difference between liberal and woke.

Liberal was in the name of compassion. For God's sakes, let's get these people off the street. Right. Woke. That's not their view.

Their view is homeless people are like an endangered species that needs to be protected in its natural environment. That's insane. Frankly, living their best life under a bridge. It is insane. But again, that's the argument.

You see why I almost have gray hair now? Because I'm always having to, like, make this argument. And I've heard people come up to me and say, well, I don't like it when you make fun of the woke. I'm woke. I'm like, no, you're a liberal.

Woke. Migrated to this other place that I'm making fun of for good reason, because it desperately needs to be made fun of. But the word does trigger people. That word woke, it means different things, I guess, to the. Exactly.

You know, people don't. Cause at first it was a kind of a good thing. At first, it was a great thing. Right. Consciousness alert to injustice.

Steven Van Zandt
Right, right. A consciousness of all know better than. The man who ended apartheid. No. If people don't know, I told.

Bill Maher
When you were on real time, I think you were, like, surprised at the direction I went with that interview, but I really wanted to highlight that part of your life, the least financially rewarding part. Well, my bandmates bought mansions that tour. No, but it is what I was saying. Then I will reiterate. It's true.

Musicians, in my estimation. I've said this here before, I'm sure. I think they overestimate their place in changing the world. They like to pat themselves on the back and say, oh, we change music based art. No, art really can change the world.

One of the few exceptions is I really feel like what you're marshaling those people for, it was at the right time for apartheid to fall. But peaceful revolutions are rare. I mean, they went from an apartheid country to another. And then some of that credit goes to that. Was it the clerk or whoever?

You know, he was the Gorbachev of South Africa, and he. But he was forced into it. Of course he was. He was. Of course he was.

But still, to manage it without a. Lot of bloodshed, well, that was Mandela's, you know, genius of coming out and saying, yes, let's. Of course, you know, it had to be Mandela. That could have been a massacre. It could have been like.

Steven Van Zandt
No one would have believed. Okay? But he came out and was like, let's be cool, you know? And again, that's, like a liberal thing to do, not a woke thing. Like, it wasn't pure purity would have been, no, we must kill the people who were wrong.

Bill Maher
Yes, they were wrong. And history's always wrong and people are schmucks. But that was such, like, for practical reasons. I always feel like liberals are more practical, like, what can practically get done. And, yeah, we should have also punished a lot of the 2008 Wall street assholes who crashed the market, but we didn't.

Why? Because it would have actually made it worse. So Obama was not pure. He didn't. I've heard that criticism a lot.

You know, Obama sold us out. He didn't put anybody in jail after. Yeah, because that would have fucking put us in a depression. Warmer, sunnier days are calling fuel up for them with factors. No prep, no mess.

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Steven Van Zandt
I've been writing a political book now for 20 years. I don't know if I'll ever finish it, but really. Oh, you know, and I wanted it to come out. Speaking of which, I have a book coming. I just wanted to give you a headshot of me.

Bill Maher
Really? Although then I remembered I gave you one for Christmas.

I have a book. What this comedian said will shock you. It looks like a clickbait. I love it. Anyway, it comes out in May.

I signed it to you. Oh, well, thank you. Copy. I think you'll be amused. It has been lol tested because these are mostly the editorials that I did on real time at the end of the show.

Collected, edited, you know, put them in a scene. Great stuff. Only the best stuff, you know, it's amazing. I had 20 years to work with to pull the best stuff. And so I think.

I think you'll be laughing on every page. And some of it I confident now that you'll agree with. There's no cameras here. It's just us. Thank you.

Steven Van Zandt
But I should side mine to you. Please do. Yeah. You did it. But you can do it again.

Well, first of all, let me just say, and I've said this before. You were a great writer right from the start. I read your first book. I think it was your first book. True story.

I think it was, yeah. That was a novel. Wow. Yeah. I'm telling you, it was a fantastic book.

I read it when it came out, I think before I even. I'm not even sure I'd seen your stand up by then or not, but. And why? I think that's a movie. Why wasn't that ever a movie?

Bill Maher
It was. We tried. Because I. You know why? Because that's just not my area of my forte.

I've learned, as the years go by, certain lessons. And one is you're not really given that many, multiple great things you're good at. So just be happy with the one or two you have. If you have two, that's a lot. So I just don't think that getting something made into a movie, getting the script right, all the stuff that goes in, that's just not my forte.

And I think the reason why is my mind works this way. Like, this book is great because it's editorials I wrote, which is like me saying one thing, driving toward a point. A script is the opposite. A script is like, I have to think about how twelve different characters think. It's not really.

Steven Van Zandt
Well, but you wouldn't have to do it necessarily in the book. It worked. Because I can do it as a novelist where you can explain everything at length and it was based on all these guys. I started with, it's about my early years in stand up. You know, it was not hard to make composite characters.

Bill Maher
I mean, a lot of the dialogue is things we actually said to each other. Fucking believe that. I believe that. But in general, that's just not my field. So that's why it never got made.

But it would have been a great movie. But you don't have to make the movie. Somebody buys the rights and you approve the script. I never got a script that I liked enough. And so funny.

It's kind of full circle because one of the reasons I wrote the book was because I was so frustrated watching how standup was portrayed. It's so hard to get it right when you try to portray it. Like when someone plays a comic in a movie you can't like, and you can see that they just told the extras, who are the audience, laugh at this. But it's not. It never reads like, oh, that really wouldn't get a laugh.

Steven Van Zandt
So did you go for Misses Maisel at that show? I've never seen that one because I was afraid that I would watch it and think just that. It's pretty good, man. I think, oh, I've heard it's great. I mean, you know, you would know better.

Bill Maher
But do they? But does it show her doing stand up? Oh, yeah. Okay. Yeah.

And it looks like real stand up to my eyes. Yeah. I mean. I mean, you would know better. It might be that.

It might be. As a comedian, I'm especially attuned to it. So it's like fingernails on a blackboard, just the way if you. You see a musician in a movie. Right.

Steven Van Zandt
It's never good. You're absolutely right. It's always funny. You know, no matter how. How they try, it's pretty hard.

It's pretty hard to pull that off, you know? Right. But Lenny Bruce was in it for a while. That was exciting. You know, he's a cameo, you know, character, which is great to see him.

And he was good, the guy who played Lenny Bruce. Really? Yes. Yeah, pretty good. I love it when people play people, famous people.

Bill Maher
I like impressions like that, even if it's not an impression. Like, just. I thought Shia LaBeouf was great as McEnroe. Did you ever see that movie? I see that Borg and Mac.

Oh, yeah. They made a movie about, like, their rivalry. And Shia LaBeouf was perfect to play John at that time of his life. I mean, must be kidding. You cannot be serious.

And you know what? I love him. He's become such a great friend. He's such a great guy. And his wife Patty.

I know, but like, he is still him. My friend. There was a party right here in this room. My friend who was a high school tennis player, he goes up to Johnny. He was so nervous to meet him.

I was like, go ahead, just say hello. Look at this room. There's twelve people here. And he says, hey, I just want to say hi. I'm such a big fan.

And, you know, I was a tennis player in high school and I, of course, wasn't on your level. And John stops me and he goes, of course you weren't on my level. I was number one in the world.

I love it when people get caught in the act of being themselves. I don't feel like they ever really captured you. I saw your 60 minutes. Not bad. Congratulations.

That's a big thing to get a 60 minutes profile. Yeah, I had one in 1997 when the show was moving to ABC. Wow. Yeah, cool. I wouldn't, I'd be afraid to look at it now.

1997? Oh, my God. What the fuck was I thinking? And how did my hair look?

Steven Van Zandt
Well, I was lucky because they did a good job and I never know how those are gonna go. They did an hour in Rome and an hour in New York and got it down to like 13 minutes. Yeah, it's amazing. Maybe it's just because I love you so much, but it always just bothers me that they put you, it always has to be something with Bruce Springsteen, who's great. I know he's your boyfriend and I mean, I'm a fan, a huge fan, but I just feel like that soul fire record, that to me is as good as any Bruce Springsteen record.

Bill Maher
And I'm. Yeah, thank you, man. Thank you. No, but I have to be conscious of it, you know, that because it's. The same kind of sound.

Obviously, you're, you're in your incremental to that or instrumental or something to that, that sound. Yeah. And we have the same influences and, you know, all that and grew up in the same neighborhood, but it's something I got to be conscious of my whole life, you know? And I said to them when they called me, because I was surprised they called me, you know, and I was like, first of all, I want to meet with the boss, you know, you know, not some correspondent, so very boss. Bruce Ringstein.

Steven Van Zandt
No, the boss of the boss of 60 minutes. And you'd see why I'd say that. That's his common moniker you picked. So the guy, I found out, the guy very, very rarely meets with anybody but he met with me, and I said to him straight up, I said, listen, if this is gonna be about Bruce, you know, I understand that. Okay?

Bill Maher
Right. But let's stop this right now because. You know, good for you. All right? And he said, no, no, we don't want Bruce to begin it.

Steven Van Zandt
Okay. Or nothing to do with him. Right. So then I said. I gave him one more test.

I said, you know, all right, now, if you're really serious, you'll come to Rome, okay? Cause we're playing Rome, and it's a really cool audience. I want you to, you know, you can take a shot of the audience, you know, but, you know, no e street stuff, and they come to Rome, okay? So now, like, you know, of course. If you're a 60 minutes producer, you want a trip to Rome.

Bill Maher
That's what you're, like, gonna fight for the budget. It's so important we do this story because Stevie Van said, I mean, you know, like, this is a gruesome story. It's the war in Syria and this. We've got to go to Rome, send the other guy to Syria. I'm going.

Yeah, I gotta be on the Stevie Van Zandt story. It's too important. So now they're, like, passing every test, right? So now I'm thinking to myself, you know, now it's right to the end of the interview and the end of this whole filming, I started thinking to myself, Jesus, I don't want Bruce thinking, I don't want him in the piece. You know what I mean?

Steven Van Zandt
I'm starting to feel a little almost. Damned if you do, because they were totally. They were totally holding up their end of the bargain. Nothing to do with Bruce. You know.

I said, you know what? I'm gonna have him come in at the end, you know. Cause I want, you know, I want him to be in it. He's my best friend, you know. I don't want him thinking I don't want him in the piece.

So I had him come in there at the end there, and it was wonderful. It was a nice little 1 minute bit. But most of it was legitimately about. Well, I mean, they asked you about the, you know, you played the consigliere on the Sopranos, and it's, you know. You know, that's all right.

That's all right. There are just some things they can't resist in the media. I remember almost the first piece I did, I must have been living out here. Must have been 1993, my old house. And they shot me.

Bill Maher
Suddenly they do it in your house around your house. So it wasn't a mansion or anything, but it had a pool in the back, so they shot me in the pool. They wanted a shot. I don't know what the fuck. And of course.

Of course, the name of the article was in too deep, and I just knew that if I had been on a tree, which they might have made me do that, too. The name of the article would have been out on a limb. And then they'll fit the article to the picture, really. Was I in too deep? They've been kind to you, the media, pretty much.

Steven Van Zandt
Oh, very. Yeah, I think so. I mean, you have a great reputation. I've never gotten a bad review on any record I've ever done. I mean, it's amazing.

Bill Maher
Really cooler to be not the front guy. Keith Richards. A lot of people would, you know, easier. It's easier. Well, it's also like, did you see.

Oh, it's my favorite of his movies, and I love all his movies. But did you see once upon a time in Hollywood? Oh, yeah. Isn't it awesome? Awesome.

Especially for people our age who remember tv in that era, how funny it is with all the references to the tv. We grew up as kids. Remember the FBI, the show, and also screen gems. It's a screen gems. The best moment was Leo doing hullabaloo.

Hullabaloo, exactly. But my point is, like, in that movie, Leo is the front man. He's the actor. Right, right. He's the star.

Steven Van Zandt
And he was terrific. And he was terrific. But I'm saying, the character he was playing, and Brad Pitt plays the stuntman and his kind of gopher. Right? Best friend.

Bill Maher
Take a. Take one for the team guy. You get shot at. Fix the antenna on the roof. Fix the antenna on the roof.

Drive me around. But because he is so confident in how cool he is. I mean, it's Brad Pitt, the perfect casting for this. It's like, he's cooler. Dean Martin with Frank Sinatra.

It depends on your taste. But I'm with you. I'm with you. You know, I feel like a lot of people, or in that camp that I'm in, like, that that guy is kind of cooler because he doesn't need the spotlight. Yeah.

Yeah, that's. It speaks of a greater confidence. It's. Yeah, I guess I'll never get Bruce Springsteen on this show now.

Steven Van Zandt
No, you know, it's true. It's true to some extent. I mean, you know, you have to. People become that. That big a star.

Bill Maher
He's handled it beautifully. Yeah. I mean, it's amazing. I don't envy that kind of. No, but some people handle it better than others.

I mean, to still be as cool as he is without selling out.

Yeah, that's at that age. And the quality of his work. I mean, this age is astounding. The latest album is fantastic. It was kind of taken for granted.

Steven Van Zandt
A letter to you. But when you read. Oh, no, I love it when you read those lyrics. I mean, come on. You know.

Incredible. Incredible at this age. And I also loved the one he did right around the same time. It was all covered. Oh, yeah, the soul tribute.

Bill Maher
Oh, yeah. Terrific, terrific. I mean, you know, we played. Where were we? San Francisco.

Steven Van Zandt
The other day he flies home to New Jersey to sit in with some country guy, Luke Bryant, you know. Sure. You know, just cause he likes him. And then flew back to San Francisco for the second show. I mean, you know what I mean?

You don't have to do that. No. Well, did you see the documentary on we are the world? Yeah. Okay.

Bill Maher
I mean, I remember when the song came out like it was yesterday, even though it was 1985. I was doing a little sitcom called Sarah on NBC with Gina Davis, Bronson Pinchot and Alfred. We were four lawyers in San Francisco, and I remember being in the makeup room as we were all getting dolled up for the show, and it had just come out and someone had it on their boombox, and we all just listened. And Mark Hudson was also on the show. He was a musician, and he was like, calling out who all the people were.

Oh, there's Billy Joel and there's Bob Dylan. And, I mean, everybody was on that. Yeah. And Bruce kind of had the lead. He had more lines than anybody.

He kind of was the. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. And he was very raspy, you know. Yeah.

Which worked for the record because it was, you know, and it's great in the documentary, that moment where Quincy Jones, they're driving home at eight in the morning, and he says to his friend in the car, boy, the white guys really brung it. I thought, what a fucking tribute from Quincy Jones. And he did bring it. But in the documentary they showed, he was in Buffalo the night before, flew all the way to California, horsed after the show, and, you know, showed up and just went, I think, right into the studio. So I love that.

Steven Van Zandt
I love the documentary. And they're completely wasted entirely. And they're doing the whole thing in one night. It's like five in the morning, and Stevie wonder decides we should have a versus why he leaves. Yes.

This is the highlight of the documentary. Was it Waylon jennings just walks, right? This redneck don't do no Swahili.

I never heard that story. I mean, no one had ever said it. Oh, my God. That's one. That's.

That's worth the price of admission. It really is.

Bill Maher
How do you feel about that? Do you feel he was justified in that to just say, I'm not comfortable? Was Willie Jennings? Yes. I was told this was going to be a, you know, I mean, no.

Steven Van Zandt
It'S, you know, probably looking back on it, he probably, he regrets it. You know, he probably says, well, I mean, they didn't end up doing this Swahili after all, so it probably would have been fine. But, you know, I don't know, you might just say both points of view. I'm not that familiar with Mister Jennings work, but I don't feel like when I listen to the song and I still love it, I don't feel like I miss Waylon Jennings. Well, that's the thing, you know, like, you know what?

Bill Maher
This song would really be over the top to me, but a little Waylon jennings because I feel like Willie Nelson covers. He's. I love his. My burning stone to bread or whatever the line is. And yeah, no, the outlaws.

Steven Van Zandt
I mean, I started a whole radio station based on those guys on serious satellite, what they call the outlaws. Whelan and Chris Christopher, Chris Kristofferson and Johnny Cash. Cause country radio wasn't playing them anymore. What is liquid death? Well, it may look like a beer or some crazy energy drink, but it's not.

Bill Maher
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And on July 14, the Riverside Theater in Milwaukee. 85. You were, that's right. When you were doing your South Africa thing, right? Yes.

You had quit the band. Yeah, yeah. I just got obsessed with politics. And that's the year right around there. Yes, right around that time.

Steven Van Zandt
I'm in South Africa doing the research. I went twice. What year did apart that end? 89. Yeah, well he, what year did they know?

Geez, I should know that. Shouldn't governments? Well, you said at the beginning you were bad at times. Yeah. He gets out of jail around 89, 90.

And then I think they had the election like 90, 90, something like that. Yeah. But what do you think of what's going on there now? I mean not good. Not good.

No, because, well, I think it's still corruption going on. I think it's so hard to fight that in countries. I mean really it's tough. I mean, you know, like look at Haiti. Oh man.

I mean it's a shame. Why do you think a place like that just never like people ask this a lot now. Like it shares an island with the Dominican Republic, right? The island of Hispaniola. Why is one place so markedly different than the other?

Bill Maher
And you know what the Dominican Republic is doing now? They're building a wall. Sound familiar? And they're gonna make Mexico pay for it. That part I made up.

They are building a wall. Why one half? What's. I don't know. I was like, puzzle.

Steven Van Zandt
The country needs to be reimagined. They were the first ones to declare independence. They were extremely influential and ahead of their time in a lot of ways. The first ones to get rid of slavery in the western hemisphere. Wasn't that some amazing accomplishment?

Toussaint revolution, and, you know, one bad thing after the other. But. But I said to everybody, you know, Sean Penn and everybody else was down there trying to help. Yes. I said, like, let's reimagine this place.

You know, have the Amazon and apple and, you know, go down there and you're like, you know what I mean? Put their. Put their companies down there or something like that, where you. You know, you just have a. A workforce, you know, and can reimagine the neighborhoods here, because there's no other way to save this and bring it back.

You know, it just never stops. Well, it's gangs, isn't it, that gangs are too powerful all through. Now it's all through Latin America, it seems like, you know, were you ever in a gang? Huh? Were you ever in a gang?

Oh, no, no. Not a crime gang. A band is kind of a gang. Yeah. Well, that was.

That was the thing, you know? The what? You know, that was the attraction for me. What was, you know, I didn't. I wasn't interested in show business.

I wasn't interested in the single person in the spotlight. Not at all. You know, it was until the Beatles, when the Beatles, Brad Pitt.

Bill Maher
You know, Dean Martin. Yeah. So when the Beatles came.

Steven Van Zandt
Yeah, the Beatles came, and we had never seen bands before, you know? You know, there were no bands in America. You know, if you went to your high school dance, it was an instrumental group, you know. Really? Yeah, yeah.

So you didn't see people singing and. Playing like the ventures. Yeah. Big, big. You know, what is adventures?

Bill Maher
Why do I know them? They. Hawaii five O walk don't run. Hawaii five oh. Those days, there were a lot of instrumental hits on the track.

I always hated instrumentals on the radio. I actually liked that song. I mean, it was good, but, like, as a kid, you want singing? Yeah. You just do it.

Steven Van Zandt
Of course. Of course. I was always. Remember, time is tight. Yeah.

That was Booker T. And the Mg. Booker T and the Mgs. Yeah. That's your kind of.

They were great. They were the house band, you know, for a lot of. That's your jam, you know? Yeah. Right.

Yeah. They were house band for Sam and Dave and. Is that right? So many others, yeah. Otis Redding.

Bill Maher
Oh, yeah. That's why they never learned to sing.

Get a singer, what does it cost? Nothing.

Right. You make money, then he. Anyway. But the bands come and suddenly there's four guys or five guys, you know, and they were like a gang. They were like the posse, a teen, you know, and they spoke.

Steven Van Zandt
It just communicated an entirely different thing to me. And I wanted to be part of that. I wanted to be part of something, you know, that we're all heading towards the same goal, you know? And that's when I wanted to be in a band. That's when I started playing.

But up until then, camaraderie. Yeah. You know, all of us who have no musical talents. When I speak for multitudes, even though many think they do, I at least know I don't. And I think we all crave that in a way.

Bill Maher
Again, not just the music, but that feeling that you're doing something with four or five or 20 or 80 other people, that's so in synchronicity, it has to be. And when it is, you probably feel a connection to them that's very hard for other people to. True, true. Yeah. No, I mean.

Steven Van Zandt
And it's satisfying. Very. It has to be very satisfying because. You'Re part of a team. It's a relationship that's working.

Yeah. You know, it's not easy. And relationships can. Like band relationships can work on stage musically when they're working horribly in every other way. I mean, what band is ever not hating each other ever?

It's true. You could almost. You could certainly easier make a list of bands who didn't. No, you're so right. It's just the nature of the beast, obviously.

And luckily, when we grew up, they kept those things secret, you know? I mean, you didn't know that till later, you know, so you bought the illusion of friendship. So we were. You know, we were third generation rock and roll in the seventies, right? So we bought the illusion that there were.

Yeah, the fifties being the first generation, then the sixties. Right. You know, in terms of rock and roll years. So we bought the illusion that they were best friends. I don't know if you ever see the Beatles second film.

Help. Of course. Yeah. Well, you know that scene where they walk up to four different flats, you know, four different apartments, right? Doors.

They open the doors and then they're all in the same apartment. Right. Well, we thought that was how it was, you know, you know, you live together, you were a band, and, you know, you're in the same apartment. Did the Beatles. I mean, they were so early on the curve of when rock got huge that they really did.

Bill Maher
I mean, when they were on the road, they're the biggest band ever. And they were sharing hotel rooms. They never had their own rooms. They were sharing the mic. How crazy is that?

Remember? And I think. And of course. Well, the mic was for harmony, balance. And of course, all of that made it better.

Steven Van Zandt
Yeah, yeah. That's one reason why the Primus into Paris, gods on Mount Olympus. Totally. Partly because of that. When you talk about the van and traveling by bus and car, they tell that story of freezing England in winter, the van being driven by their roadie, and they're in the back lying on top of each other for warmth.

Bill Maher
Well, they said for warmth.

No, but can you imagine? And they'd have to, like, switch after a time because the guy in the bottom was getting squashed. I mean, that will. That band was tight. Yeah.

Steven Van Zandt
It's hard to believe they never got their own rooms, you know, it's so funny, right? But yeah, you know, they were just making up the rules as they went. I also loved it when they. I loved the sharing of the mic. Just as a fan, just as an eight year old kid watching them.

Bill Maher
There was just something about watching them spit in each other's faces from two inches away. But keep in mind there were no monitors. Monitors was a recent development. Okay. You know, when they played Shay Stadium.

It was the PA system. The PA system. There's no monitors on stage. Okay, what do the monitors do for you? That's what you hear.

Steven Van Zandt
You don't hear the Pa. You only hear the monitors. So the Beatles are not hearing anything, right? I know. Okay.

And Ringo has said he had to follow visually.

And I was at Shea Stadium, and they sounded like the records. They sounded perfect. Cause they're on the same mic, they could hear each other. So the harmony was balanced and beautiful. And because they were lying on top of each other and they spent 8 hours night on stage in Hamburg.

That's right. You know, they were forged in a way. I don't know if a band to lever be forged again. It's true. It's probably right to YouTube.

Well, that's the problem. And I've talked about this many, many times. A lot of speeches after speech. You can't skip that bar band stage, man. Don't skip it.

It's such an important stage, and these days you can learn your instrument and make your own record at home and put it right out on the Internet, man. But you're skipping that most important stage of interacting with an audience, interacting with a band, seeing what effect those songs have on an audience, all of that, you know, it's like doing stand up without an audience, you know? Are you saying Justin Bieber isn't hard? Because didn't he go right from, like, grade school to, like, ushers? Wasn't he ushered into show business?

Bill Maher
Or am I getting that? Well, certainly somebody adopted him. And then certain genres work better than others, okay? Straight. Straight to the online business, you know, but rock and roll isn't one of them, okay?

Steven Van Zandt
Rock and roll is more like stand up. Do you ever. Do you ever collaborate with any collaborator? No. Come on.

Bill Maher
You know what? That is not the worst idea anybody ever had. Any of you kids listening out there, you would be a very cool, like, out of the box collab. Any of these kids today, you know?

Steven Van Zandt
You never know. You never know. But, you know. But you're saying you're not waiting for it. Yeah.

Bill Maher
And I'm telling you it would be cool. But you can. You can emphasize certain common ground, you know? I mean, the craft is craft, man. And there's cool.

There's. And lots of kulaks out there who I think are great. You wouldn't collab with, you know, post Malone or. Oh, I'd collab with anybody. Call me.

Steven Van Zandt
Call me tonight. Tonight. I'm not busy. No, I'd be happy. The weekend I'd be happy to do.

Bill Maher
It would be awesome. I'd be happy to collaborate with fucking, like. But I just don't think of it. You know what I mean? I don't reach out to them, you.

Know, bring the soul fire to Justin Bieber. Could use a little, you know, I'm right here. I mean, look at this guy. What are you, 70? And you got hair on your chest.

It's completely black. What the fuck is that? I don't know. I can tell. You don't dye it?

Steven Van Zandt
No. That's pretty great. No, at your age, I guess I never thought about that. Cause in my mind, I'm still 25. That's probably why.

Bill Maher
That's probably why, you know, you kind of. I mean, we all age, obviously, but you basically look the same, you know, like, some people, they just have a very different look. And some people are just like, oh, that. It's their look. That's the brand I've gotten used to.

Yeah. It's a little rough around the edges, I mean, but that's as good as you can do as we go through life. Yeah. I mean, Mick Jagger's about to go on tour. Kind of love it.

He's 80, right? Yeah. To do the kind of show he does at 80. Come on. That generation and, you know, the whole baby boom generation are just completely changing the concept of time and chronological time.

Steven Van Zandt
I mean, when I grew up, I didn't know any. Nobody was over 65 or in, you know, I didn't know anybody in their seventies. I mean, the grandparents were, you know, half of them were in homes in their sixties. In the sixties, you know, they were dead. Yeah, yeah, were dead.

I mean, you know, I know a dozen people in their eighties who were on stage working, you know, and the whole british invasion is turning 80. This, you know, this Townsend, right. All of them, right. They're all going to turn 80. I mean, these are, you know, my heroes growing up and.

Bill Maher
But you can't. They're still out there. You can't go on forever. I mean, that. Well, eventually it'll end, I guess.

Steven Van Zandt
But, you know, I don't look forward to that day, I tell you, in movies. I mean, Clint Eastwood, I thought, went as far as you possibly could credibly, because, first of all, I'm a giant fan. I just love his movies. I think he's a great filmmaker. And as an actor, also, I think, very underrated.

Bill Maher
I think he should have gotten an Oscar for in the line of fire. Did you ever see that one? The good one? Yeah. Such a great movie.

Wolfgang Peterson. Oh, anyway, but very late. He's making great movies. Great movies. I mean, the one with Morgan Freeman, I think it did win.

Steven Van Zandt
It might have won movie of the year. The western. Oh, geez. Oh, talk about unforgiven. Yeah, that was 1992.

It was. You don't know time. Jesus Christ. With Gene Hackman. 90.

Bill Maher
219. 92. Oh. He'S made like 50 movies since then. That's the most recent I think I've seen.

You didn't see Gran Torino? No. Oh, you are in for such a treat. Yeah, Gran Torino. He was maybe 75 when he did that one.

Steven Van Zandt
How long ago was that? Oh, like 15 years. I mean, he's like. He did one. Look, he did one, like last year when he was 90, and I was like, okay, for all you've given me in the past, I'll let it go, but come on, man.

It's done. It's over, huh? I mean, you gotta. You can be a director until you're 150, I guess. But, you know, I just feel like, yes, there is limit to everything.

Bill Maher
We are only human. But I just love the fact that Rolling Stones are still out there, man. Cause, you know, that makes us the new guys on the block. Like, you have a show tomorrow night, right? Yeah.

So, okay. So what is your routine? I mean, is there any difference in prep? No, no. You were 23.

No, no. In fact, I do more now because I do the meet and greet before the show. You have a meet and greet? Oh, hundreds tomorrow. Hundreds of people.

And what, they paid an extra? Oh, no, that's a different meeting. I also do that for my foundation. That's for Chad. What is his friends.

This is just friends. And you do it before the show? Yeah. Because you want to get out of there after. Well, yeah.

Steven Van Zandt
I have a certain philosophy about this. And everybody different. Everybody different. But when I'm off that stage, at the end of the show, the office is closed. Right.

Bill Maher
Okay. You know, right now, I'm like, no, I know. You know, I'm done. Do you do an Elvis exit? Like, where you just go right from the building?

Steven Van Zandt
Sometimes. Sometimes. Really? Yeah. Like before, but usually just to beat the traffic, you know?

Bill Maher
Right. You know, you don't want to. You get. It's horrible to get caught in your own traffic. Yeah.

Steven Van Zandt
Yeah. So most of the time we do that. Not horrible compared to so many things in life. Not bad compared to the station wagon, you know, in the van. Keep things in perspective here.

Bill Maher
Exactly. But, you know. But, yeah. Tomorrow will be la, New York, London. And these are all.

I mean, this is. But every city. Every city, I will do a meet and greet for the foundation. Right. Well.

Steven Van Zandt
And I raise. I bet you do. I'll raise $3 million this year. Who wouldn't want to. Wouldn't want to get this close to you.

Yeah. We just charge more for the ticket and shake your hand, take a picture. I understand. Oh, yes. That's like $3 million, you know, for.

Bill Maher
The foundation every year or every show. Every tour. Every tour, you know? Now, some people do it for their own profits, and, like, that's fine, you know? I mean, I don't want to mention any names, right.

But. Oh, they all do it, you know? Not all, but many. Many. I mean, there is.

There is what they call gold circle. Yeah. I've been offered these things. Yeah. I.

You know, to me, I'd have to be a lot poorer. Went for this. And you're right. I could do it for a foundation or something. But I'm not as good as you.

I'm just like, well, not everybody likes. To do the meet and greet before the show. You know, they have a routine like you. Like you were saying, some people have to meditate and do all these things. You know, I'm like, right.

I'd rather. You know, also, I'd rather give my actual money. It's so funny. When I was younger, if they asked me to do a charity, I always do it. And very often it was tough because charity audiences are the worst, certainly for me, because I'm politically incorrect.

And charity, that's, like, the most politically correct atmosphere, because it's a charity. We're like, oh, we're good people doing a good thing, and it's a good night. And just so, like, it was always painful to me, and I got to a certain point in my career where I was like, whatever it is, don't make me perform for those people. I'll give you the money. Whatever money you think I would have raised by being there, I'll just give you the money and not have to face this fucking oil painting of an audience that I could never possibly do well in front of.

I mean, and these people who should love me like I did ones for, you know, animal charities, I mean, that's my cause, Peter. I love them. I'm with you. They get the lion's share of my charity. And that's where my, you know, whatever people.

Some people love babies. I love animals. Okay. Yeah. But I prefer audiences there.

And it's like, you know, just come on.

I know we're good people for a good cause, but you gotta loosen up a little, you know?

Steven Van Zandt
Well, that's why. Who was it? It was probably you. And among others. I think Seinfeld just stopped going to colleges at a certain point, right?

Similar. All of us. I actually quote. I did a piece on it once, maybe you're remembering, and I quoted him. It was him.

Bill Maher
Chris Rock and Larry the cable guy had all, at about the same time, announced they weren't playing colleges anymore. I had given them up long ago because I remember saying, you know, a jew, a black guy in a redneck walk into a college campus, and they can't wait to get the fuck out of there. But it's true. Like, when Jerry Seinfeld, Chris Rock and Larry the cable guy all find it intolerable, maybe it's you. And it is.

I mean, college is where humor goes to die. These fucking kids, these Hamas supporting morons who go to these elite colleges, the mouth of the river from which all the woke nonsense flows down from. Yes. Kind of an early. An early woke thing in the extreme sense that you were talking about.

Steven Van Zandt
Right. Maybe started in those colleges. Right. Colleges is absolutely where it is that early woke philosophy. Well, because academics, they very often live in this.

Bill Maher
I mean, that's where we get the term ivory tower, where everything is theoretical, because they're in the classroom and they're very often left leaning. I mean, they're almost all left leaning from the beginning, and then they're, like, partial to theoretical stuff. I mean, communism, which is still fairly popular, even though, you know, on that kind of far, far left, because first of all, the younger ones, they don't study history, so they don't really get it that. Yeah, no, we tried it. It's actually way worse than what we have.

Way worse and makes more people more miserable and is way more oppressive. If oppression is your thing, you do not want to live in a communist country. I mean, you know that. Well, yeah. And again, the different forms of it, because I spent a lot of time with the Italian Communist Party, which is very different than Soviet Union or China or whatever they used to be.

Steven Van Zandt
But most of the time, people don't actually learn the definition of these words anymore. They just kind of adopted. But the Italians got over their flirtation with communists. I mean, for good reason. But it was in its political philosophy, you know, and I'm not here to defend it, other than to say, as a political philosophy, it had nothing to do with the.

The dictatorship of the proletariat did not mean dictatorship. You know what I mean? It was misinterpreted and turned into this fascist, basically a fascist on the other side of the spectrum, you know? But the idea of communism, you know, this idea of everybody sharing things, you know, was not a. Was not altogether.

It's in its. In and of itself a bad thing. It was just turned into a very bad thing. Everywhere it was. Everywhere it was used.

Bill Maher
It's not a bad idea. It's a bad idea to take it seriously as a model for how you could govern any place, because people are selfish. Exactly. And you have to take advantage of that selfishness, which is what capitalism does. As bad as capitalism is, it's still better than any other thing, because we've tried all the others.

And true, all you have to do, if you don't believe that, is watch that movie, the lives of others. The german movie was one best foreign film, like, ten years ago, something like that. Oh, you should see that the lives of others. It's genius. It's about East Germany, you know, when it was communist and just how like.

And this is factual. I mean, they reflect it in the movie and the story, but two out of the three people of the citizens were reporting on the other one. I mean, you just don't want to live in that country or a country where you can't get rich. People have to think, I could be next. I might win the big check next time.

They just do. It creates energy. And look, this country has a lot wrong with it, but one of the things we still have going for it that I know when I talk to anybody who's young or foreign is they still feel, well, this is a place where you can, like, you know, reinvent yourself every day and maybe make a fortune, and there's not a lot to hold you back if you're willing to really have something new and work hard. True. True.

You know, a lot of countries don't have that. No, they stop you. No, it's true. Absolutely true. You know, we could just.

Steven Van Zandt
A couple little fixes would make a big difference, man. You know, I mean, some kind of, you know, a billionaire tax. I would start with, you know what I mean? I mean, you know, when you start sending ships to Mars, you know, maybe you make a little too much money. You know what I mean?

Well, I mean, it's something to consider. That's why I always compare capitalism to a raging river. Like, you wouldn't want to reverse the flow of the river because that's communism. It's not going to work. But you want to harness that power as it goes in the direction it's meant to go to, towards selfishness, because we are.

Bill Maher
But you do need dams and locks on the river because otherwise you do wind up with, I mean, we're going to have a trillionaire at some point. Trillion. And the disparity, I mean, you know, the disparity of wealth, I mean, at. That top levels, it's insane, because I've read pieces where people prove that even if you tried and you were up 24 hours a day, you couldn't spend all that money. You couldn't spend $200 billion.

It's really hard. Unless you're building a ship to Mars, you know? Right. And, you know, spending too much on Twitter and then killing it. Well, Elon, you know, Elon legitimately believes, and this is an opinion I don't share but deserves respect.

I think he legitimately believes that we need to be a two planet species because we're going to fuck it up here. And I agree, we do look like we're going to fuck it up here, but we've always looked like we're going to fuck it up here. My argument always has been knowing what I know about Mars, which is, you know, I'm not what an astrophysicist knows, but I do know there are basic facts. Like, it has no fucking air and it's 200 below zero, and there are dust storms that last for six months. And you would have to live underground because the radiation.

That's what I know about Morris. So my point is, and no room service, how bad would we have to fuck up Earth where it was worse than that? And it was like, if it was worse than that, okay, I just call it a day. But I'm not going to Mars. No.

Steven Van Zandt
I mean, it's not. But he's sincere about it, and he's probably right. We probably will need a side piece planet because we're gonna fuck this one up so bad. And that if you want. If you think the human race should continue, some people don't.

Bill Maher
I don't care. I really don't do. What would it be? Yeah. Would it be horrible?

Steven Van Zandt
It hasn't gone well. It has gone well. I think it's amazing how well it's gone. Look at us. But not for 90% of the country.

Bill Maher
That's not true anymore. That's not true anymore. I mean, the amount of progress we have made in the 21st century about what they called extreme poverty, like people who live on a dollar a day. People who, you know, there was a time when a billion people defecated in the street.

Those stats have all gone way down in the 21st century, muchly due to capitalism. Even though there are purists who were like, how dare they build sweatshops? Because you know what? Sweatshop was better than shitting in the street? The rice paddy.

Whatever. Yeah, the rice paddy, exactly. Whatever. And it's a bridge to. I mean, look at all these countries like Vietnam and Korea and Singapore and like, Malaysia and China that started out, what, like, agrarian.

In our lifetime, we've seen them move to sweatshop and then to a really discernible, respectable middle class. India, you know, has a lot of poor people. It also has a very big middle class and some very rich motherfuckers. True, true. I just, you know, you can just kind of even up the score a little bit, I think would make a big difference.

Steven Van Zandt
And if musk, you know. No, it's true. I agree. You know what I mean? I agree.

He must put his money into, like, maybe some practical use on the ground, you know, rather than going to space. Well, maybe things would improve a little bit. This is the guy who already gave us the electric car, so you can't, you can't rob him of that. Maybe the stupidest invention ever. The electric car.

I mean, come on, why? Oh, not the electric car. I mean the self driving car. Oh, okay. No, no, I didn't mean the electric car.

Which one is the self driving car is the stupidest invention I agree I've ever heard. I mean, all it's doing is putting tens of thousands of people out of work. And are you gonna trust one of those things? No, I mean, you know, that's gotta be the stupidest invention ever. Also, because they're very.

Bill Maher
To work properly. Again, theoretical versus real life. In theory, they work because they're tested on, like, very smooth, good roads. Where are they? I live in a rich neighborhood and the roads are horrible.

Steven Van Zandt
Exactly. La cannot give you the kind of roads you need to have for self driving cards, and they probably never will. But I mean, it's insane. It's insane. And they spend billions on this.

Billions. He's got a lot of bad ideas. He's got a lot of great ideas and a lot of bad ideas. He's, you know, put a lot of. Bad people back on Twitter.

A lot of bad people. Well, and you think people should be banned from free speech? Well, I'm kind of with the Germans on the Nazis, I gotta tell you the truth. Okay. Just about had it with his first amendment stuff.

Bill Maher
Okay. At this point, I'm like, you know. That'S not very liberal. No, I'm issue by issue. But I'm telling you right now, you know, nazis.

Steven Van Zandt
Nazis are a special class of people in my mind. You know, they definitely are. You know, but then you think they just disappear. That's the problem is like, wouldn't you rather know what they're saying? No, I know, I know, I know.

And you have a good point. You have a good point. Where do you, you know, but, you. Know, if you own the thing, you know, do you have to let him in? I don't know.

We're at a dangerous point right now. Are you optimistic?

Yeah, a little. A little bit. Okay. I don't think he's gonna get reelected, you know? I really don't.

Bill Maher
You mean Donald Trump? Yeah, I really don't think so. I think this wannabe, forthright, you know, that he's part of. I don't think he'll succeed but we have to admit that, oh, it's very. He's smarter than our, he's certainly smarter than our justice system.

Steven Van Zandt
Okay. I mean, that we know. Okay. You know, forget about Justice Department. He's smarter than our justice system.

I mean, at this point, it was, it's not, it's not built for people like him. Well, a lot of spitting and judges faces. History. There is a theory they call the great man theory of history, which basically is saying, obviously, that certain men come along and you men, because most of history, but Joan of Arc, maybe in this category, person of history will say, that's the important person, the Winston Churchill, the Napoleon. Other people say, no, history has its giant tides that ebb and flow and people just basically manage them.

Bill Maher
I would say technology is the determining factor in most of history. The technology changes in people that then we just have to adopt. But in the great man theory, who were you talking about to forget a minute ago why I started this whole conversation?

Oh, no, I was the great man theory. Like, I feel like with a great man in place where Robert Mueller was or a great man in place where Merrick Garland is now, I feel like things could have been different. I feel like a great person in those jobs, I think. Feel like Mueller blew it. I'm with you.

I did a whole thing on it once. I'm with you, and I feel like. But Merrick Garland blew it again. Here we are, almost four years after the elections, right around the corner, and nothing has still come to trial. I got to blame that at somebody.

Steven Van Zandt
I got to say, I don't blame the bad guys. I blame the good guys, you know? What do you mean? We're the tough good guys. You can't blame the bad guys for being bad.

That's what they do. Okay. You know what I mean? Who would know that better than who was your character? You were Sylvio Dante.

Bill Maher
Silvio. Right. You know, I blame the good guys. You know, I don't blame the RNC for the problems we have. I blame the DNC, you know?

Do you have any acting things coming up? You like to be an actor, too. I know. I want to get back on tv, but I'm stuck in, you know, we got a. We, we postpone a lot of shows.

Steven Van Zandt
So this whole year now we'll be making that up. Yeah. Yeah. You know. So the tour is just starting, restarted.

Yes. For how many? How many now? We will do 52 shows, I think. In how long?

The rest of the year. The rest of the year. You get a month off here, a month off there, but mostly the rest of the year. Do you ever. Do you never do two nights in a row?

Never. That's good. No, it's very civilized at this point. I mean, very. You know, it's wonderful.

It couldn't be more civilized. I mean, sometimes two days. A lot of times two days off in between shows. So you always feel fresh. Yeah.

And, you know, at this point, you know, it takes a day or two to heal, you know? Right. You know. You want to play the football game. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Your voice. Yeah. And it's very physical. Yeah. I mean, it is.

Bruce, Bruce, it is, because, you know, you're up. You're up. You're standing up for 3 hours, let. Alone the show is still 3 hours long. Yeah, yeah, just.

Just under. Yeah, that's a long. Yeah, that's a lot. That's a lot of, you know, your fingers must hurt. Well, that's what I mean, you know.

Bill Maher
Do they. We're in good shape. No, once you're in shape, it's okay, really. But that's what I mean, if you have two days off in between. But just mentally, like, you know, it amazes me how you guys can remember, like, all the lyrics.

Well, all the chords. Well, I have to tell you, I don't mean to blow our cover here, but. But there are teleprompters now, of course. Yeah. Yeah.

Steven Van Zandt
But a lot of bands still don't have them, you know? What about the notes? Well, do you ever, like, on my. Teleprompter, it's chords and lyrics.

Bill Maher
I just go full hog and get. Get a fucking hologram. Well, that's. That's next. That's next.

Steven Van Zandt
I saw the Avatar show. I saw. I saw the Abba Avatar show. It's quite remarkable. Wait, the what?

There's an ABBa avatar show in London. Oh. They're showing what the future is going to be. It's going to be avatars, you know? And what does it look like?

Amazingly good. It looks like Abba. Yeah, it really does, you know, and that's going to be the future of this. But. Because we can't tell.

Bill Maher
It's. It's a image. No, I mean. I mean, maybe if you were, you know, in the first row. But we, you know, we were, you know, 20 rows back and it looked very good.

Real, like, as if you would not even know it was not ABBA. Pretty close. Wow. Yeah. Yeah.

Steven Van Zandt
And for the Renaissance period of music, okay. Which ended. Okay, that stuff that's not being replaced ever again is gonna live forever. I think as avatars. What is the Renaissance period?

Well, I consider basically the fifties, sixties into the seventies as a renaissance period where the greatest art being made was also the most commercial. But that's not what Renaissance means. Renaissance means rebirth. Renaissance has to do with something from way back when. The Renaissance is art, but it's taking the ideas of stuff from antiquity, which were dormant in the Middle Ages.

Well, but shrink the time now, the chronological time to the fifties being the naissance. Okay. All right. The sixties becomes the Renaissance, where the best art, most. The greatest art was also the most commercial.

That's. That's. That's a renaissance. That's how I define a renaissance. All right?

And that's not being replaced. You know, it just diminished every decade since, you know, in terms of the quality level. And that's. Well, of course the kids would just say that's. In your opinion, grant?

I don't think they would argue with that. Oh, I do think so. I don't know. I think every generation. Look, I don't get a lot of what the young kids listen to music, but that's what my father said.

Bill Maher
I agree. I think I agree with you. That's what our father said, only we're. Right.

Steven Van Zandt
But I never. I never. You know, I didn't diminish Frank Sinatra's value. I learned about it later. You know.

I mean, I didn't like it at the time when I was growing up, but I certainly love it now. And that's what kids, kids, by the time they get to 17, 1819, everybody goes to a pop period. That's natural. Right? Right.

11, 12, 13 years old. You're into pop music. You know, by the time they get to 16, 1718. Now they discover the doors. They discover led zeppelin they discover us.

We got a lot of kids in the audience, you know, and, you know, the pop stuff kind of fades away now. It's not. It's a little bit more transparent, a little bit more. No, you know what I mean? As opposed to the sixties when the pop music was the greatest music being made, it was wonderful, you know?

And I don't know. Yes, it's a matter of opinion. It's a bit subjective, I suppose. But all I know is they're not going to be a whole lot of future, you know, looking back at this period of time, I don't think musically, you know, there's exceptions to the rule. Of course there's exceptions to the rule.

Bill Maher
I'm pretty much exactly where you are on this. Except that. Yeah, there's. I don't feel like there's anybody who is consistently putting out the. Just sheer number.

I mean, I go by how many songs are. You are in my ipod of yours. That's how I. And, like, could I put together a great playlist of stuff from the last ten years? Yeah, but it would be like, you know, two from this person, one from this person.

Steven Van Zandt
Right. Like, I could do it, but it's just, to me, there's so much more crap surrounding it now. When we were kids, there was crap too, you know? Of course. I mean, there was bubblegum music, which we didn't like, and.

Bill Maher
Or maybe we did. I don't know. You shade it now, more bubblegum. But even bubblegum, not yummy, yummy, yummy. I got love in my tummy.

That was bubblegum. No, but. But sugar, sugar. Did you hear Wilson Pickett's version of it? Sugar, sugar is not the worst.

It's not my favorite, but it's. I agree. It has potential. I mean, sometimes you could do a funky version. He does.

I'm sugar shirt. Fantastic. Really, you gotta get it. Wilson Pickett. Yeah, Wilson Pickett.

Steven Van Zandt
But anyway, your point, though, is correct. Of course. You know, of course there was. There was lesser stuff, but we had pop, rock and roll pop hits. There hasn't been a rock and roll pop hit in 2030 years.

Bill Maher
And also, here's the difference. Our stuff from that era is still heard all the time. Commercials and movies. People know lots of songs from this late sixties, especially seventies, eighties. But when you go back when we were kids, if you go back that same amount of years, nobody knew anything from exactly 19.

Steven Van Zandt
That's exactly right. 15. That's exactly right. This music has really endured more. That's right.

Bill Maher
And. And that's why I think it's very important right now for the publishers or the writers or whoever it is, to change the law, okay? Because you can record. If I record a song, you can record that same song without any permission. You have to give a little percentage of it.

Steven Van Zandt
You know. You know, you have to pay a percentage of it. Whatever. Nine tenths a song, whatever it is. But you can record the same song.

Right? That's not true. In comes movies and film. You know, you need a special license. Okay?

And right now, because the record industry is dead, okay, there's no more record sales other than Taylor Swift and Beyonce. Right. You know, and it all goes to Spotify. Well, that's the thing. You get no money.

Okay? But worse than that, you know, you got a bunch of, whatever, 25 year olds with a song list with a number next to it. So if you want to make a movie or tv show, you ask for the song, they look at the number and they charge you that number, which is always high because there's no other income, right? Correct. Well, the problem is, I know right now, three or four great documentaries that are not going to come out because they can't afford the license to songs, okay?

And this is a real problem. And I think ten years from now, 20 years from now, it's going to be a problem because all this music is going to die if it's not promoted and heard like you're talking about. You know, it's going to be like Motown, who? Rolling Stones, who? It's not.

Oh, yeah. Oh, no. Believe me. Believe me when I say this, all right? When we started, music and movies was free.

It was free. It was part of the, you know, artist Korseski didn't even ask for permission to put be my baby in mean streets, okay? Because it was free, you know, and people thought of it as promoting the records. Nobody's promoting the records anymore. But when our generation goes, who's gonna know about this stuff?

Bill Maher
You think they're not gonna be playing born to run in 100 years? Oh, please. I hope you're right. Oh, of course. But it would be helpful if they saw it in a movie where a lot of kids discover music, okay?

Steven Van Zandt
You see it in a movie, you see it in a tv show, things have come back on the charts from a song in stranger things. I hear you, bro. But I gotta say, of all the problems in the world, I cannot put. Movies are going to be bereft of great songs, like right at the top of the list. You hear me?

No, there's not that type of list. But I'm just telling you right now, a lot of documentaries are not going to come out. And I just feel it shouldn't be a permission thing. It should be a percentage of the budget, you know what I mean? If your budget is 200 million, then five or 10% can go to music.

Bill Maher
Be really. But if it's a $10,000 documentary, you. Know what I mean? How much do you think documentaries have actually changed the world? Like actually changed.

Getting back to my thing about you and apartheid, I really think you put an issue on the map and then soon after there was movement, it started a ball rolling that didn't stop till it was finished. I do find that very rare. And not to pick on documentaries, I mean, I made one religious. It's a documentary, a comedy documentary. Did very well, about religion.

And there are people who come up to me privately when I'm out and say, I saw your movie and I'm an atheist now, but I don't feel like. Well, it. Okay. Yes, I guess one drop in the ocean here and there. Well, that's all we can do.

Steven Van Zandt
What else can we do? Well, I do feel like your apartheid thing was bigger than a drop in the ocean. I feel like it was lucky, though. I got lucky. Okay.

Bill Maher
The timing was right. You stepped into a thing and you saw an issue and you laser focused on it, and you. That is really an anomaly, because honestly, as wh Auden wrote once, art is small beer. He said, art never stopped one jew from being shoved into the ovens. Well, if they see a documentary on the Holocaust, it might keep this fourth Reich out of the White House.

I don't think it will. I just don't think people. One vote, two votes, nothing. I mean, I don't know. How do you know?

It might make them vote for it. You just don't. These kids today. Kids today with the marching for Hamas and the. And the crazy haircuts and the jeans.

Oh, they. I say we dropping his stink bonds on Vietnam. Am I right, Stevie? Okay, we'll be back to rock chat. Let's do a show together.

I should be on your radio show and do rock chat. Yeah. Cause I know a lot about music. I'm sure you do. No, really, I do.

People note that. I mean, just as a fan, it's very liberating to not have any musical talent, because then you're just a fan. Really? Yeah, absolutely. Anytime.

Steven Van Zandt
Anytime. Let's do something. You know, I mean, we'll invent a new segment. You know what I mean? The Bill Maher, you know, coolest songs according to Bill this week.

You know something? You know, we can do something. Well, you know, we could do a whole show on the ipod as opposed to modern streaming, even though people are probably sick of me hearing. Hearing me talk about how I still use the ipod. But I would like to have the time and space to make a full brief for the ipod.

Bill Maher
The old ipod. The moment, the circle in the middle. What looks like the transistor radio. It looks like it's right. You're right.

It did. You have. I remember having a transistor radio at the beach on Long Beach island. Oh, yeah. Do you know Long Beach island?

We used to. You're Jersey, right? Yeah. You do? I know the area, yeah.

Did you ever go there? Like. Do you. Yeah. That's Jerry.

Steven Van Zandt
Jerry Blavitt. Territory right down. What's that? Yeah. Famous DJ.

Bill Maher
Oh, no. But isn't that near where your Asbury park? It's further down. Of course it is, but not that much. Well, was it considered like Bougie to you guys?

Steven Van Zandt
It was. Maybe it was a little more. No, it's 45 minutes or. Right, but. And I guess you had to.

Bill Maher
Well, see, there was a storm in 1962, a hurricane or something that blew the houses all the way from the ocean into the bay across the island, and it was declared a disaster area. So my father swooped in in 1964 when it was like a disaster area and bought a beach house for $18,000. A duplex. Good move. Yeah, right on the beach.

Steven Van Zandt
It was across the street. There was the beach, and then the street started, which is barely paved. And there was one house, and then we were the second house from the beach. Yeah, I mean, you could be in the water and if you ran in 90 seconds. Right, right, right.

Bill Maher
Oh, yeah. Protected by the wall. Right. There was like a wall, a stone. Oh, no, just a road.

Just a road jetty at some point. But I mean, when you get up. A little bit further north. No, I mean, that's one reason why it was so cheap was because that did happen once. But I guess they just were like, fuck it, you know, at some point they started to build again and, you know, people, I don't know, got suckered in again.

There's definitely no wall. I mean, how could you build a wall? You can't build a wall. No, up like seabright and long branch. You know, there was a.

Steven Van Zandt
There's a stone wall in between the beach and the road. You know what I mean? You know, on the other side of. The beach, there's a big wall that's fucking ugly. Who wants to live?

Oh, and until the hurricane comes, then it kind of. Well, I don't want to live. I don't want to live by the water at all. Anyway, I would. So you still have the house down here?

Bill Maher
No, I mean, we sold it in the eighties or my. I mean, it's probably worth 10 million now. It is. It probably is. It's amazing.

I would shudder to think. It's probably a million dollar property. That's. Your father had the foresight. Yes, 18.

But. But you. But you're. You never went to the Jersey shore. That wasn't a part of your whole.

Steven Van Zandt
Oh, yeah, we were considered. I was in Middletown, which is, you know, 20 minutes. What county was that? Essex. Monmouth County.

Bill Maher
Monmouth. Right. We played all the beach clubs that was part of the circuit. Right.

Steven Van Zandt
So, yeah, we were. That was your hamburg? Yeah. The beach club. Yeah.

And asbury and the upstage club. What are beach crowds? Better or worse? What now? Like, anytime like beach, because I feel like the beach is a different.

Bill Maher
Is a world of its own. Even though we live. I only live, like, what, 10 miles from the beach. Whenever I go out to the, you know, like, Hermosa beach or one of those towns, it's like a whole different. World, a different culture.

Yeah, yeah. Not better or worse. I'm not criticizing. I'm just saying I don't know what the crowds would be like. Would it be more laid back, or would they be, like, so relaxed?

They were great? I don't know. Well, you know, that whole scene was the first stoners, the first surfers. You know, they were all kind of ahead. Ahead of the curve with that stuff, but, yeah, a little more relaxed.

Steven Van Zandt
But we never were a member of a beach club. My family was middle class, but, you know, not that high up. So we play all the beach clubs, you know, and it was mostly middle class audiences back then. But it was great because, you know, when you're a teenager, especially then, there's no rules, no adult telling you what to do because they didn't know what rock and roll was yet. You know, it's not great you had that.

Bill Maher
Because I'm sure as long as it's been. Now that you've been in front of the stadium crowds, I'm guessing it just never gets old. You never, like, take that for granted. Having lived through the lean years, especially now, it just must be such a joy to hear so many people so excited by you. Yeah.

Steven Van Zandt
No, because I have a record label with a lot of little bands, and we can't get people to come out. We just did a tour with four bands, all of whom could tour on their own. Terrific bands. We didn't do 50% of the capacity of any club. It's hard to get people to come out.

So you're so right. I don't take it for granted. When you look at that list of, like, who makes the most money touring, it's almost all the older bands. I mean, obviously Taylor Swift, Beyonce. There are ones that probably are at the top.

Bill Maher
Like, other than that, it's Paul McCartney, it's the Rolling Stones, it's you guys. Yeah. You two are the new guys.

Steven Van Zandt
They're the latest ones that break through. Probably the last ones that break through. All right, well, I mean, there's a couple, you know, green day, you know, there's some that do do well. But you don't look like you need. To rest up for the show.

Bill Maher
But I'm going to let you go and release you back into the wild. Because I don't know, I kind of like it here. Can't I live here? You can. I said here all night.

They told me you had to be out at seven. Look how good. Look how good I did.

What is it with the drugs? You have such a good life, why do you need drugs on top of it, huh? It's been so long, man. Remember? Yeah, me too.

Steven Van Zandt
Yeah, me too.

Bill Maher
Yeah, me too.

Steven Van Zandt | Club Random with Bill Maher

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1: Opening Discussion

2: Musical and Acting Careers

3: Political Commentary

4: Anecdotes and Reflections

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